Motorcycle videos

Topics relating to Advanced Riding on bikes
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Horse
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Re: Motorcycle videos

Postby Horse » Thu Jun 22, 2023 7:45 am

Another good distinction: rising or falling. I think that in the rising my main effort would be to get up to (or above) likely traffic speed, then find a gap.

You also reminded me of the guy who used to do Blue Riband instructor assessments for me. On one occasion a candidate noted that he went up a motorway slip road and continued the straight line out to lane 3.

Further distraction/ derail. One of his 'test principles' was to do what the candidate told him. Once, he was sat on his bike and the instructor (helmet off) stood alongside and explained what to do next. Terry nodded understanding, thumbed the starter, into first and away.

All sounds extreme. But one of those instructors said, soon after, that trainees were even more inventive :)
Your 'standard' is how you drive alone, not how you drive during a test.

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GTR1400MAN
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Re: Motorcycle videos

Postby GTR1400MAN » Tue Jul 25, 2023 3:10 pm

I'm often asked what my everyday riding is like when I'm not observing or making videos. Well here's a refresher ride for myself on a mix of town, dual carriageway and country B roads. This is your chance to see the ride, warts and all, from the view of a mentor, and observe what my positioning and riding looks like from behind. I hope it is useful to anyone taking an advanced course/test, of whatever flavour. I realise it's a long video so there's lots of chapters so you can jump about and/or watch it in chunks.
Mike Roberts - Now riding a Triumph Explorer XRT. My username comes from my 50K miles on a Kawasaki 1400GTR, after many years on Hondas of various shapes and styles. - https://tinyurl.com/mikerobertsonyoutube

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Horse
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Re: Motorcycle videos

Postby Horse » Tue Aug 22, 2023 11:32 am

1:25 in and I a have thought for your consideration: at the T onto the road, you're turning left. If you stop left foot down, the bike is already leaning slightly into the turn.

Rather than start a long document, I'll add to this post.
Your 'standard' is how you drive alone, not how you drive during a test.

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GTR1400MAN
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Re: Motorcycle videos

Postby GTR1400MAN » Tue Aug 22, 2023 1:24 pm

Horse wrote:1:25 in and I a have thought for your consideration: at the T onto the road, you're turning left. If you stop left foot down, the bike is already leaning slightly into the turn.

Rather than start a long document, I'll add to this post.

Thanks. Considered. My thoughts: I've stopped with some angle on already. I find it easier to twist my body to look right with my right foot down. I'd agree if I drifted towards the centre line as I pulled away, but I didn't.

I can, and do use left foot down at times, but the whole "which foot" okey kokey dance (Hendon shuffle) stuff can be debated to death. Is it smooth? Was it safe? Was the rider in control?

The IAM book used to say left foot for left turns, right for right ... but quite correctly that was removed as being too prescriptive.
Mike Roberts - Now riding a Triumph Explorer XRT. My username comes from my 50K miles on a Kawasaki 1400GTR, after many years on Hondas of various shapes and styles. - https://tinyurl.com/mikerobertsonyoutube

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Horse
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Re: Motorcycle videos

Postby Horse » Tue Aug 22, 2023 10:09 pm

GTR1400MAN wrote:
Horse wrote:1:25 in and I a have thought for your consideration: at the T onto the road, you're turning left. If you stop left foot down, the bike is already leaning slightly into the turn.

The IAM book used to say left foot for left turns, right for right ... but quite correctly that was removed as being too prescriptive.


Starting at an angle is a useful skill to practice.

I learned it with the MSF and have subsequently taught many riders.

Done 'properly/completely' it includes:
- foot down the side you're turning to
- 'pointing' / angling the bike the direction you intend to go
- reach the 'down' foot slightly forwards
- slightly turn the bars the direction you intend to go

Head and eyes up, looking where you want to go. Start to go, pick up foot and drive.

It's actually a good confidence test! But it means you've started the turn before entering the main road.

When particular trainee was on the point of giving up riding because of difficulty getting out of their 'home' side road onto a major road. This sorted it.
Your 'standard' is how you drive alone, not how you drive during a test.

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GTR1400MAN
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Re: Motorcycle videos

Postby GTR1400MAN » Wed Aug 23, 2023 8:01 am

Interesting. Didn't know it was an MSF thing. I don't remember seeing it in the book I read. I'll have to dig it out again.
Horse wrote:When particular trainee was on the point of giving up riding because of difficulty getting out of their 'home' side road onto a major road. This sorted it.

Surely it was the small amount of angling the bike (which I coach riders to do) that made the difference, not the foot choice?

There's plenty of left turn T junctions where a left foot down will have the rider either on the ground or having to hold up a leaning heavy bike, due to the steep camber of the road surface.

The foot down thing comes up regularly on some of my videos, with people firmly in one camp or the other. I have to say I personally use left foot down once in a blue moon, and they are situations where I have to. With Associates I discuss the pros/cons of each option but never try to change what they are doing unless it is causing a problem. For a lot of town riding, right foot down is just so much more relaxing and less tiring and is a no-brainer for me. But I've been doing it that way for a long time.
Mike Roberts - Now riding a Triumph Explorer XRT. My username comes from my 50K miles on a Kawasaki 1400GTR, after many years on Hondas of various shapes and styles. - https://tinyurl.com/mikerobertsonyoutube

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Horse
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Re: Motorcycle videos

Postby Horse » Wed Aug 23, 2023 10:46 am

GTR1400MAN wrote: Interesting. Didn't know it was an MSF thing. I don't remember seeing it in the book I read. I'll have to dig it out again.


If it's their big book published years ago, don't bother.

It was in the syllabus of their learner course. See next post for the RiderCoach 'range card' for the training.

GTR1400MAN wrote:
Horse wrote:When a particular trainee was on the point of giving up riding because of difficulty getting out of their 'home' side road onto a major road. This sorted it.

Surely it was the small amount of angling the bike (which I coach riders to do) that made the difference, not the foot choice?


If all put together as a full combo, it's really effective.

The angling will help, yes, but bar turn and leaning (not something to do with the other foot down!) means the bike is already turning - not just 'pointing'. Big difference.


GTR1400MAN wrote:Interesting. Didn't know it was an MSF thing. I don't remember seeing it in the book I read. I'll have to dig it out again.
There's plenty of left turn T junctions where a left foot down will have the rider either on the ground or having to hold up a leaning heavy bike, due to the steep camber of the road surface.

The foot down thing comes up regularly on some of my videos, with people firmly in one camp or the other. I have to say I personally use left foot down once in a blue moon, and they are situations where I have to.

But I've been doing it that way for a long time.


I learned in bluebook days and rode a succession of boingy-forked Bimmers. I would use right foot as an option eg camber, surface.

We had a trafpol on one of the MSF's post-test courses. He had been trained 'right foot down' (mandated, the way he explained it). MSF required, for part of the training and test, right foot up. It really played with his head!
Last edited by Horse on Wed Aug 23, 2023 11:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
Your 'standard' is how you drive alone, not how you drive during a test.

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Horse
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Re: Motorcycle videos

Postby Horse » Wed Aug 23, 2023 11:37 am

http://the-ride-info-new.blogspot.com/2 ... t.html?m=1

Image
Image

Note this was for novice riders, typically on smaller bikes. Many riders on larger machines wouldn't get both feet down (including my trainee).

Looked in the book (Motorcycling Excellence), not there.
Your 'standard' is how you drive alone, not how you drive during a test.

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Horse
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Re: Motorcycle videos

Postby Horse » Wed Aug 23, 2023 11:50 am

NB it's worth noting that it is difficult to explain how far ahead of uk training the MSF was. The learner and experienced courses were developed in the 1980s and included content that wouldn't appear in Roadcraft until the mid-90s and that the DSA (as was) were LaLaLa about :(
Your 'standard' is how you drive alone, not how you drive during a test.

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GTR1400MAN
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Re: Motorcycle videos

Postby GTR1400MAN » Wed Sep 20, 2023 9:52 pm

Here's my latest quick tip video

Mike Roberts - Now riding a Triumph Explorer XRT. My username comes from my 50K miles on a Kawasaki 1400GTR, after many years on Hondas of various shapes and styles. - https://tinyurl.com/mikerobertsonyoutube


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