The most difficult aspect of Advanced Driving

[Horse]

[ With many of the drivers that others speak in awe of I can feel uncomfortable with aspects of the drive. Usually entry speeds to hazards, balance and relying on the car to get them round a corner. The problem is, as they are highly respected, is it me that has it wrong? Probably, so who am I to comment.

Having sat with you, I'm happy with your speed choices [See my 'boring' post although actually it was just 'uneventful' ]

[StressedDave]

Just tell them you're uncomfortable and why (based on something other than an internal feeling). It's not rocket science. Just because someone is a 'better' driver, technical or not, doesn't mean that they're not having a bad day and need to rein the horses in a bit. You aren't Uriah Heep... If they can't explain (note, not justify - I know a few accomplished drivers for whom the justification tends to be with the benefit of hindsight. The best I heard was "I meant to drive off the road at that point") then what they're doing isn't right.

Personally, I don't trust any driver, including me.

[Rick448]

I have certainly had better drivers (of whom there are many!) drive me in a way I wouldn't have driven, but I trust that they can spot issues / plan / etc. better than I can.

Alasdair

Who says they are better? I've been with a couple of drivers who are supposedly brilliant drivers, well I didn't think so. That's not to say I thought I was better but it felt like they were trying too hard. I didn't feel comfortable at all nor was I impressed with some of the overtakes which I felt were over aggressive and unecessary.

I do think there is a lot of drivers out there who are perceived as being great but I guess it depends on what great is. To me a great driver is someone I feel comfortable with, who can make good progress safely and also knows when to hold back.

[Gareth]

Who says they are better? I've been with a couple of drivers who are supposedly brilliant drivers, well I didn't think so. That's not to say I thought I was better but it felt like they were trying too hard. I didn't feel comfortable at all nor was I impressed with some of the overtakes which I felt were over aggressive and unecessary.

Sometimes the situation doesn't help; when driving for practice there is a tendency to try ones hardest to get the most out of that limited time, and as a result it can be too easy to wobble around the fine line between good and not so good.

[Strangely Brown]

... when driving for practice there is a tendency to try ones hardest to get the most out of that limited time, and as a result it can be too easy to wobble around the fine line between good and not so good.

I have found that trying too hard can easily result in a drive that just feels scrappy and disjointed. The hard part - for me - is to relax, let go, stop trying so much and just let the good things happen on their own. Only when relaxed and driving naturally does it all come together. If I try to force it, it falls apart.

[akirk]

I have certainly had better drivers (of whom there are many!) drive me in a way I wouldn't have driven, but I trust that they can spot issues / plan / etc. better than I can.

Alasdair

Who says they are better? I've been with a couple of drivers who are supposedly brilliant drivers, well I didn't think so. That's not to say I thought I was better but it felt like they were trying too hard. I didn't feel comfortable at all nor was I impressed with some of the overtakes which I felt were over aggressive and unecessary.

I do think there is a lot of drivers out there who are perceived as being great but I guess it depends on what great is. To me a great driver is someone I feel comfortable with, who can make good progress safely and also knows when to hold back.

because I know where I sit in the journey of learning how to drive maybe better phrased as I was worse then them
but also because I could recognise certain aspects of their driving which they just performed more smoothly, more fluidly, more joined-up etc. than I could - and I was recognising primarily that I wouldn't drive in the same way as I didn't have those same skillsets...

I didn't feel unsafe - just recognised that had I chosen the same approach the results would not have been as good...

however, unlike stresseddave's comment above, I have never actually driven off the road (unintentionally )

Alasdair

[StressedDave]

... when driving for practice there is a tendency to try ones hardest to get the most out of that limited time, and as a result it can be too easy to wobble around the fine line between good and not so good.

I have found that trying too hard can easily result in a drive that just feels scrappy and disjointed. The hard part - for me - is to relax, let go, stop trying so much and just let the good things happen on their own. Only when relaxed and driving naturally does it all come together. If I try to force it, it falls apart.

Just out of interest, why do you go out to 'practice' your driving? Surely you should be aiming for your 'best' driving to be your default 'style'. Obviously I'm looking back from 20+ years since I did my first chunk of driver training with HPC Ltd, but I don't think I've ever gone out with the 'I'm off to practice my skills' mindset.

I've never had much time for the 'challenge' boys who think they've got to drive just a little bit beyond their capabilities to improve. You improve by putting in the hours making it natural. I'm lucky, I got to have a year's sabbatical from work (Translated as my former employer gave me a big chunk of money to never darken their doors again and I spent a lot of time working out what I wanted to do with the rest of my life) so spent the vast majority of it driving with my peers and supposed 'betters'.

[Horse]

I've never had much time for the 'challenge' boys who think they've got to drive just a little bit beyond their capabilities to improve.

Often, if trying to include heightened self-awareness and reflection, it's necessary to operate below 'peak' otherwise you run the risk of running out of brain power and talent . . .

[Gareth]

Just out of interest, why do you go out to 'practice' your driving? Surely you should be aiming for your 'best' driving to be your default 'style'.

Imagine all your driving is just daily commuting on motorways and going to the local shops. Would you think of a forum-organised day of driving as anything other than practice? How about if all your normal driving was on motorways and urban roads; would a larger proportion of rural roads on the forum-organised driving days still feel normal? Would the skills you employ be the same?

[StressedDave]

For me the skills don't change (Disclosure here - I mostly drive the A14 to and from work, but I get paid to drive to sites which, because of our client base, tend to be out in the countryside) - you might not do as much bend assessment, but you've still got to employ whatever system of planning you use. It is all the same - those that only dust off certain skills in the package for particular days are those that I worry about.