Advanced Driving Hub

Gareth wrote:

Horse wrote:It struck me later that it could have been a deliberate action, to take some attention / concentration, so that I couldn't focus on 'putting on a show'.

It seems to me this would have been done to help you feel at ease. but then it's up to you how long it continues and how involved the conversation becomes.

That was my initial thought. But a chance comment someone made (in a different context) made me wonder.

Gareth wrote:

Edmund Kean wrote:I do believe from the above overtaking example - I have acted in accord with an element of roadcraft, that being… Giving clear information.

Having slept on it, I'm less certain that's true. Information only has value if it's received. I would view what you described as an attempt to be courteous, delaying your overtake to do so, which compares with my preference to say thank-you after the event.

I hope I've correctly understood your description of the sequence to be ... out, checked it's safe, indicated for a few seconds, then passed ... rather than the more 'interesting' ... out, while checking it's safe indicate for a few seconds, then passing ... which I'm sure you do not mean, as that'd have you courtesy indicating before concluding it's safe to pass.

When opportunities are limited, and based on the coaching I've received from various sources, I'd prefer to not waste even a few seconds when it's on.

I thought the post was quite clear. I mentioned the road was narrow and widened up ahead, so this understandably had a bearing on my actions and when I went.

Gareth, it's been interesting engaging with you (and others) and for that matter, I believe we have participated gamely for the sake of the forum. This has allowed me to acquire information from you and the other contributors. For the time being, I am resistant to change my approach but I will think about it all and, likely re-read the whole thread in the coming days or so.

I'll just leave this here...



No implications intended.

It is an interesting discussion - esp. considering the superb level of driving some on here are known to demonstrate... It is also an indication that perhaps as advanced drivers we have a tendency to over-think at times?!

Ultimately - every scenario is different - looking for a rule to use is probably lower down the pecking-oder of driving levels than the driver who knows all the options, analyses the situation and chooses what they believe to be the best solution for that situation. I have just driven back cross-country from the south coast today - there were a considerable number of overtakes (always amazes me those who don't overtake from behind a lorry when I have space to pass lorry them and a couple of others - and I was in my wife's suv!) - many of which seemed very similar - but each of which was treated very differently - and indicators were used (I hope) appropriately based on my reading of the other road users - from the 'I am doing 40 an inch behind the lorry and haven't noticed any other cars on the road' driver - to the fast approaching sports car behind who might not instinctively have expected me to overtake - the choices I made differed even when it might have appeared to have been a similar situation...

Strangely Brown wrote:I'll just leave this here...



No implications intended.

And I'm sure most here will know about the Dunning-Kruger effect.

Or do we ... ? Irony meter to 11, we may not be quite right in what we think!

https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... 0knowledge.

akirk wrote: It is also an indication that perhaps as advanced drivers we have a tendency to over-think at times?!

Ultimately - every scenario is different - looking for a rule to use

To be fair to the OP (and without bothering to go back and check ), it was more about clarification of meaning and gaining understanding, rather than wanting a rule for all occasions.

What the discussion show is the high potential for our actions (including signalling) to be misunderstood.

[Warning: 2nd hand war story]
A colleague was at a family get-together. That he was a motorcyclist was mentioned. Other person said he'd recently followed a rider who couldn't control their bike -weaving all over the road. A bit of questioning determined that the rider was probably using cornering lines ...
[/]

Horse wrote:And I'm sure most here will know about the Dunning-Kruger effect.

Or do we ... ? Irony meter to 11, we may not be quite right in what we think!

'I am the wisest man alive, for I know one thing, and that is that I know nothing.' - Socrates

This thread reminds me of a curious incident last week, heading south into Streatley on A329.

As soon as I slowed for the 30 limit I could sense that the driver behind, in a beat up Golf IIRC, was disinclined to obey the limit. Sure enough, as soon as I passed the traffic calming chicane, still doing 30, he pulled out for an overtake on the double white lines. Nothing unusual really, just one of these moments you really wish could have been witnessed by a traffic officer with time to take an interest.

What caught my interest was, he actually signalled with indicator. But not for moving out, it was a brief flash left before crossing back to correct side of the double whites. We then stopped behind a couple other cars at the traffic lights and as we all pulled off, out he went again, passing two more cars by the Bull pub and youth hostel driveway. And again, a very deliberate left indicator before pulling back in.

I wondered whether, in his world, random use of indicator somehow turned bad driving into good driving?

I know that junction and that overtake was little short of barking mad, whether not indicating ...

Triquet wrote:I know that junction and that overtake was little short of barking mad, whether not indicating ...

To be clear there were two overtakes… one passing me on the double whites, then a second when he passed two further cars as they pulled off at the lights.

Absolutely barking mad, I agree. Can’t think of any excuse.