Reg Local - How to pass an Advanced Driving Test

[GTR1400MAN]

at a left turn rather than be in the correct gear they'll feather/slip the clutch as they execute the turn.

I was thinking about this today while out on a longer practice drive; it was more than two hours in and I was feeling weary, (or lazy), approaching a tight left, had optimistically assessed I could use 2nd gear. Turned out I really needed 1st so, to avoid the car shuddering, I dropped the clutch going into the turning then picked it up after.

What I've found is that the move to a DCT car has improved my accelerator finesse no end. Jumping back into our manual car I find that the car is so much more capable than I ever gave it credit for. It will go through those slow junctions and crowded residential streets on just a sniff of fuel in 1st and 2nd gear, and that temptation to dip the clutch has been almost removed.

[crr003]

There's no arguing that if you can do good P-P you can deal with anything.

I would beg to disagree. It is possibly the worst steering technique in emergencies and is more likely to make the situation far worse. Any one who has done hazard evading training knows this to be the case. (Look to where safety is and do whatever needs to be done to steer there, but don't rely on pull push to avoid having an accident.)

Advanced drivers ideally have a variety of mastered steering techniques and know when to use them. Maybe not everyones opinion but it is my belief.

I suppose I was rather hoping on an IAM/RoADAR type of drive that we wouldn't be getting to the emergency stage!
Maybe the issue is for people who don't delve too deeply into AD, they just want to be a bit safer etc, too many tools in the toolbox just becomes a distraction, especially under some sort of pressure. Maybe that's why the Police settled on the methods they did? I recall on my Masters being told by God's Gift to Driving (the Examiner), that my fixed grip was unnecessary and that he could do anything with P-P.

I'm reminded of skid training I went on at Throckmorton. Driving back to the Portacabin for tea from the runway, the instructor flicked the switch to activate the skid cradle thingy. The driver, having just tried all the techniques to deal with skids, jumped on the brakes and we went through some cones! (It wasn't me, honestly. I'd own up).

[Horse]

There's no arguing that if you can do good P-P you can deal with anything.

I would beg to disagree. It is possibly the worst steering technique in emergencies and is more likely to make the situation far worse. Any one who has done hazard evading training knows this to be the case. (Look to where safety is and do whatever needs to be done to steer there, but don't rely on pull push to avoid having an accident.)

Advanced drivers ideally have a variety of mastered steering techniques and know when to use them. Maybe not everyones opinion but it is my belief.

I suppose I was rather hoping on an IAM/RoADAR type of drive that we wouldn't be getting to the emergency stage!

There's an 'advanced driving' group on LinkedIn. The owner/manager threatened to ban me. My crime? I posted some advice which related to the PP / airbag discussion that was going on about 10 years ago.

The advice, from an airbag expert (unfortunately I can't quote him by name as he had also provided it elsewhere), was very simple: impending impact? Let go of the wheel.

My interpretation takes this further: if you're heading into an open corner, with nothing to hit, cross arms if you want to. If a blind bend, etc, PP. Then, if impact ... let go whatever.

The group owner didn't want such advice on his group, it had to be 'do it properly' or nothing. His view was that driving properly negated the need for such thinking. I wonder whether he ever practiced emergency stops?

[crr003]

There's no arguing that if you can do good P-P you can deal with anything.

I would beg to disagree. It is possibly the worst steering technique in emergencies and is more likely to make the situation far worse. Any one who has done hazard evading training knows this to be the case. (Look to where safety is and do whatever needs to be done to steer there, but don't rely on pull push to avoid having an accident.)

Advanced drivers ideally have a variety of mastered steering techniques and know when to use them. Maybe not everyones opinion but it is my belief.

I suppose I was rather hoping on an IAM/RoADAR type of drive that we wouldn't be getting to the emergency stage!

There's an 'advanced driving' group on LinkedIn. The owner/manager threatened to ban me. My crime? I posted some advice which related to the PP / airbag discussion that was going on about 10 years ago.

The advice, from an airbag expert (unfortunately I can't quote him by name as he had also provided it elsewhere), was very simple: impending impact? Let go of the wheel.

My interpretation takes this further: if you're heading into an open corner, with nothing to hit, cross arms if you want to. If a blind bend, etc, PP. Then, if impact ... let go whatever.

The group owner didn't want such advice on his group, it had to be 'do it properly' or nothing. His view was that driving properly negated the need for such thinking. I wonder whether he ever practiced emergency stops?

Wasn't an Eddie was it?

There's definitely a school of thought that says just let go - the car will sort itself out if there's enough space. Then grab the wheel again and off you go. I think Andy Walsh (who can steer Elises) advocated this if it had got this far.

[jont-]

There's definitely a school of thought that says just let go - the car will sort itself out if there's enough space. Then grab the wheel again and off you go. I think Andy Walsh (who can steer Elises) advocated this if it had got this far.

Although Elises aren't known for their electronic aids. Most modern cars should have at least some sort of stability control, assuming the driver hasn't turned it off. Letting go also avoids the problem of catching the first slide, but not getting the correction off quickly enough and snapping the other way.

[Horse]

Wasn't an Eddie was it?

Couldn't say

To be fair, having been back to check, he didn't offer to ban me, instead wouldn't accept the post:

Me
" ... posts I've made in another thread seem to be 'hung' in limbo. Should I raise this as an issue with LinkedIn?"

Reply
".. because its a bit of a floodgate and letting some through means that other people expect the same 'right' to post their stuff, even though their pontifications have no support whatsoever from either research or best practises -- something else our group rules emphasise.

This is why one of you other comments is, as you put it, in limbo. I am not at all convinced by the argument for letting go of the steering wheel, because I wouldn't want panic-stricken drivers doing it too early, when they might have had a chance to reduce some aspect of the danger. I will happily post your comment in question if any research exists to substantiate the technique but in the absence of such, I wouldn't be happy to do so.

No disrespect intended."

[jcochrane]

There's no arguing that if you can do good P-P you can deal with anything.

I would beg to disagree. It is possibly the worst steering technique in emergencies and is more likely to make the situation far worse. Any one who has done hazard evading training knows this to be the case. (Look to where safety is and do whatever needs to be done to steer there, but don't rely on pull push to avoid having an accident.)

Advanced drivers ideally have a variety of mastered steering techniques and know when to use them. Maybe not everyones opinion but it is my belief.

I suppose I was rather hoping on an IAM/RoADAR type of drive that we wouldn't be getting to the emergency stage!
Maybe the issue is for people who don't delve too deeply into AD, they just want to be a bit safer etc, too many tools in the toolbox just becomes a distraction, especially under some sort of pressure. Maybe that's why the Police settled on the methods they did? I recall on my Masters being told by God's Gift to Driving (the Examiner), that my fixed grip was unnecessary and that he could do anything with P-P.

I'm reminded of skid training I went on at Throckmorton. Driving back to the Portacabin for tea from the runway, the instructor flicked the switch to activate the skid cradle thingy. The driver, having just tried all the techniques to deal with skids, jumped on the brakes and we went through some cones! (It wasn't me, honestly. I'd own up).

However good we are emergencies happen that are not of our own making. Diesel on the road is one example.

[crr003]

However good we are emergencies happen that are not of our own making. Diesel on the road is one example.

I doubt I'd be able to cope. I had a day at the Porsche Experience Centre Silverstone in a mid engine RWD - I knew where the kickplate was but I could never deal with it. Every single time.
Someone will be along to say there's been studies to show things like skid pan training are counter productive to road safety as they give a false sense of security anyway. They're great fun, but I think unless one is practicing this stuff a lot, then as I said before, most drivers will struggle to incorporate the techniques into their daily system, especially under stress.

[Horse]

Someone will be along to say there's been studies to show things like skid pan training are counter productive to road safety as they give a false sense of security anyway.

Hello

I could find something if you like

Possibly not stress, more likely:
- surprise, you're not expecting it, so are not mentally prepared
- startle, you freeze rather than doing something useful, even if you're expecting it

[jont-]

However good we are emergencies happen that are not of our own making. Diesel on the road is one example.

I doubt I'd be able to cope. I had a day at the Porsche Experience Centre Silverstone in a mid engine RWD - I knew where the kickplate was but I could never deal with it. Every single time.
Someone will be along to say there's been studies to show things like skid pan training are counter productive to road safety as they give a false sense of security anyway. They're great fun, but I think unless one is practicing this stuff a lot, then as I said before, most drivers will struggle to incorporate the techniques into their daily system, especially under stress.

Apart from masochists in old cars, isn't the right thing to do just stamp on the brakes and point the wheel where you want to go and let the electronics do its thing these days? Whenever I've tested a stability system - eg at Porsche doing things like split grip braking - I've been very impressed how clever they are.