E-scooters safer than bicycles - says ROSPA

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martine
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E-scooters safer than bicycles - says ROSPA

Postby martine » Thu Apr 28, 2022 4:17 pm

Martin - Bristol Advanced Motorists: IMI National Observer, Group Secretary, Masters (dist), DSA: ADI, Fleet, RoSPA (Dip)

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angus
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Re: E-scooters safer than bicycles - says ROSPA

Postby angus » Thu Apr 28, 2022 5:06 pm

I basically like the idea of e-scooters. I first saw them in quantity in France a few years ago and I liked what I saw. But there they were ridden responsibly in a wide pedestrianised area.

I live in a town where there is a trial going on. Here they are mostly ridden by young adults with the sense of invulnerabity that age group seems to have, weaving in and out of pedestrians and traffic, and I have had several near misses, both as a pedestrian and a driver.

With today's news that future legalislative approval is likely, I hope that registration and insurance are manditory from day one, and that it includes e-bikes too.

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akirk
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Re: E-scooters safer than bicycles - says ROSPA

Postby akirk » Thu Apr 28, 2022 5:19 pm

Will be interesting to see how that compares with the NHS statistics...
They are apparently recording increasing numbers of casualties of various levels (not sure which of those would then be reported into the DfT stats that RoSPA uses).
My wife is a hand surgeon and is seeing quite a few patients resulting from e-scooter incidences...

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Horse
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Re: E-scooters safer than bicycles - says ROSPA

Postby Horse » Thu Apr 28, 2022 8:43 pm

akirk wrote:Will be interesting to see how that compares with the NHS statistics...


An aside: there is sometimes a difference between NHS and STATS19 annual data. For fatals!
Your 'standard' is how you drive alone, not how you drive during a test.

martine
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Re: E-scooters safer than bicycles - says ROSPA

Postby martine » Fri Apr 29, 2022 11:15 am

I'm confused - the report says 1 fatality whereas I thought I'd read 9 fatalities already reported but I can't remember where...dammit.

Some people around Bristol ride them responsibly but many don't with 2 people on the same e-scooter, or on pavements (which is illegal) and others ignore red traffic lights. I reckon there is likely an significant increase in injuries and fatalities due to e-scooters but how many are hired or private I don't know.
Martin - Bristol Advanced Motorists: IMI National Observer, Group Secretary, Masters (dist), DSA: ADI, Fleet, RoSPA (Dip)

martine
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Re: E-scooters safer than bicycles - says ROSPA

Postby martine » Fri Apr 29, 2022 11:35 am

And in today's news:

https://fleetworld.co.uk/government-to-clamp-down-on-e-scooter-safety-issues-in-legalisation-plans/

That paints a rather different story to the ROSPA report...doesn't it?
Martin - Bristol Advanced Motorists: IMI National Observer, Group Secretary, Masters (dist), DSA: ADI, Fleet, RoSPA (Dip)

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GTR1400MAN
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Re: E-scooters safer than bicycles - says ROSPA

Postby GTR1400MAN » Fri Apr 29, 2022 2:50 pm

ROSPA e-Scooter Report wrote:RoSPA has reviewed the UK incident records of Neuron Mobility, a leading E-scooter and E-bike operator, and
has used the data to help assess the risk profile of E-scooters in comparison to alternative modes of road transport.

ROSPA e-Scooter Report wrote:The data relating to the cycling records, both the number of E-scooters and the recorded miles covered, are subject to estimates.

ROSPA e-Scooter Report wrote:Road safety statistics in Great Britain are based on personal-injury accidents that are reported to the police. However, a considerable proportion of non-fatal casualties, involving all forms of transport, are never reported.


So "finger in the air" estimated data. I could write a report estimating completely the opposite way.

It's highly likely the many accidents with e-scooters, while being used illegally, NEVER make it to any form of stats or report.

Another point to consider is that there is huge confusion any time e-scooters are mentioned on social media. It is very clear the public have no idea about the difference between a child's toy, an e-scooter you ride standing up, and an e-scooter that is an electrically powered small motorcycle.

If you wanted to design a vehicle that is unstable and you are likely to fall off, you couldn't do much better than a standing scooter. Direct steering with virtually no rake or trail to give stability, plus tiny wheels that are deflected by the smallest of road/pavement irregularities (and how smooth our roada nd paths are!)
Mike Roberts - Now riding a Triumph Explorer XRT. My username comes from my 50K miles on a Kawasaki 1400GTR, after many years on Hondas of various shapes and styles. - https://tinyurl.com/mikerobertsonyoutube

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Horse
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Re: E-scooters safer than bicycles - says ROSPA

Postby Horse » Fri Apr 29, 2022 10:14 pm

GTR1400MAN wrote:It's highly likely the many accidents with e-scooters, while being used illegally, NEVER make it to any form of stats or report.


Vaguely like the 1980s 'Minter' report comparing motorcycle and car insurance claims. Similar claims per mile rate, just the outcomes are likely to be different.

I had umpteen crashes while biking. Only one had police attending, so made it into the stats (ironically one of the slowest crashes!).

GTR1400MAN wrote: virtually no rake or trail to give stability, plus tiny wheels that are deflected by the smallest of road/pavement irregularities (and how smooth our road)


FWIW, I understand that there has been research in the EU and UK on (amongst other things) the stability of e-scooters.

Have you seen these articles?

https://motochassis.com/Articles/Balance/BALANCE.htm

https://motochassis.com/articles/experi ... -geometry/

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Re: E-scooters safer than bicycles - says ROSPA

Postby Jonquirk » Sat Apr 30, 2022 5:51 am

Two fascinating articles Horse.

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Re: E-scooters safer than bicycles - says ROSPA

Postby sussex2 » Sat Apr 30, 2022 11:33 am

In Spain these vehicles are exactly that, vehicles.
The things must be drive on the road and all rules apply to them.


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