Brake and their RoadMap

[Horse]

I don't think the way we can judge the rate of approach of a distant object is its growth in size. The angular change of its width is very small until it gets closer than is relevant here.

'Looming'

Dot in the distance
Dot
Dot
Dot
WhereTheFDidThatComeFrom?

Worst in a head-on approach.


[Language warning- turn the sound of if easily offended] Edit: bleeped version.

[hir]

If it's impossible to judge the speed of oncoming traffic, perhaps the police should be banned from overtaking.

The police are allowed to overtake because they're specially trained to overtake safely, they have massive blue lights and deafening sirens, and every driver around them just slams on their brakes, whatever the circumstances, to let them pass. Unlike the stupid, incompetent, dangerous, aggressive and unsafe hordes of morons that blight and infest our roads at present, who recklessly attempt to overtake at every conceivably dangerous opportunity with horrendously catastrophic consequences for kittens, hedgehogs and other innocent road users.

Just a thought before I sign up for Brake... does anyone know if Brake advocate banning all overtaking, including when walking or cycling?

I think we should be told!

[jcochrane]

It is still a human using mk1 eyeball to judge how much and how quickly a remote object is growing in size.

I agree with the principle of what you and others are saying but I don't think that bit is correct. I don't think the way we can judge the rate of approach of a distant object is its growth in size. The angular change of its width is very small until it gets closer than is relevant here. I think we have to base our judgement on other things such as the amount of scenery the approaching vehicle has passed in a given time and the increasing amount of detail we can see of the vehicle. I think I attach more importance to attempting to judge the available distance. When there is no oncoming vehicle in sight I look for at least 3 times the distance I expect to need for my overtake and when there is an oncoming vehicle I am more cautious than that.

A high-speed overtake in the face of oncoming traffic is indeed one of the most difficult things to judge. However I suspect that those with the training and confidence to do it tend to overtake more safely than the less skilled overtake bicycles when too close to a blind bend..

I agree Mark. Speed is a measure of time and distance and that is how we estimate it. Nothing to do with the size of something.

[jcochrane]

Just a thought before I sign up for Brake... does anyone know if Brake advocate banning all overtaking, including when walking or cycling?

I think we should be told!

I am an elderly model of the human race and now now walk at a reduced speed (and a little unsteadily). During Lockdown I would camp out all night at the supermarket to ensure being first in the toilet roll queue. Doors opened only to have younger models than me rush pass and clear the shelves. So I will support BRAKE if they advocate a ban on overtaking when walking as long as it is a blanket restriction and not just on pavements.

[Horse]

I would camp out all night at the supermarket Doors opened only to have younger models than me rush pass .

.. as long as it is a blanket restriction

No wonder they got past, if you had a blanket.

[hir]

Just a thought before I sign up for Brake... does anyone know if Brake advocate banning all overtaking, including when walking or cycling?

I think we should be told!

I am an elderly model of the human race and now now walk at a reduced speed (and a little unsteadily). During Lockdown I would camp out all night at the supermarket to ensure being first in the toilet roll queue. Doors opened only to have younger models than me rush pass and clear the shelves. So I will support BRAKE if they advocate a ban on overtaking when walking as long as it is a blanket restriction and not just on pavements.

Excellent, I agree with you John. No overtaking of us venerable* citizens, whatever the mode of transport.

I am slightly confused though. I quite understand that I mustn't overtake you if we're both out walking, but would I be allowed to overtake you when you're walking and I'm on a bike? I suspect not. It just worries me that when BRAKE succeed in getting cars banned from the road their next target will be the banning of all cyclists! Come to think of it that would actually be a good idea because they're just as stupid, incompetent, dangerous, aggressive and unsafe as the hordes of other morons that blight and infest our roads at present.

I look forward to that utopian day when the roads are completely free of any form of motorised vehicles and cyclists. Occupied only by non-overtaking pedestrians wandering about without having to look left or right, not having to worry about priority at junctions and going about their lawful business without a care in the world. All thanks to the determined and resolute members of BRAKE. Thank you BRAKE.


* venerable defined as: those accorded a great deal of respect, especially because of age, wisdom, or character.

[akirk]

I enjoyed a lovely run today from Keswick down to Cartmel along by Windermere - overtaking much of the traffic on the way (they seem to not notice when it changes from 30 to derestricted), never once worried about it being an issue judging oncoming traffic/ road space etc. Brake can carry on as much as they like - if they persuade everyone else to trundle along at 30mph they simply become easier to pass…

And as an aside the Rogan & Co restaurant is fab!

[userLeft1]

Surely the whole point of being able to complete the manoeuvre within 50% of the distance judged as being available is because it is impossible to guarantee getting right.

[jcochrane]

Surely the whole point of being able to complete the manoeuvre within 50% of the distance judged as being available is because it is impossible to guarantee getting right.

Presumably that is +50%

[hir]

Surely the whole point of being able to complete the manoeuvre within 50% of the distance judged as being available is because it is impossible to guarantee getting right.

Just a thought but, I would suggest an overtake needs to be completed within one third of the distance seen to be clear.

If you make it 50% it doesn't take account of the oncoming vehicle/motor bike that may appear a fraction of a second after you've committed to the overtake. 50% may mean a tight squeeze to get back in or the oncoming vehicle has to brake to let you back in.