Driving Test Changes

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Strangely Brown
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Re: Driving Test Changes

Postby Strangely Brown » Wed Apr 26, 2017 1:27 pm

crr003 wrote:
Strangely Brown wrote:
martine wrote:
Mr Cholmondeley-Warner wrote:... and, Mr ADI, what is a UK flash supposed to mean... ?

Legally or in common use?


What would be the expected interpretation on test?

Highway Code #111
Pretty clear.


I believe that was the reason behind Mr. CW's question.

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GTR1400MAN
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Re: Driving Test Changes

Postby GTR1400MAN » Wed Apr 26, 2017 1:36 pm

Strangely Brown wrote:
martine wrote:
Mr Cholmondeley-Warner wrote:... and, Mr ADI, what is a UK flash supposed to mean... ?

Legally or in common use?


What would be the expected interpretation on test?

Surely the same as the rest of us?

Still assess, proceed with caution if you believe it is safe. No point sitting there saying it's the other vehicle's "right of way' while annoying all around.

My IAM car examiner even mentioned it in his pre-drive briefing as he'd had people sticking to the letter of the law causing stalemate with poorly parked lorries or large vehicles trying to manoeuvre in small streets.
Mike Roberts

crr003
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Re: Driving Test Changes

Postby crr003 » Wed Apr 26, 2017 1:42 pm

Strangely Brown wrote:
crr003 wrote:
Strangely Brown wrote:
martine wrote:Legally or in common use?


What would be the expected interpretation on test?

Highway Code #111
Pretty clear.


I believe that was the reason behind Mr. CW's question.

That's about #110?
#111 tells you what to do when dealing with normal drivers who flash.

'Driving the Essential Skills' similarly explains not to do it , but people will do it.

They tell you not to do it, but then tell you how to deal with it. Maybe it's time to re-write the rules. In the old days you had to find a switch on the floor with your left foot (so grand dad told me). Everything's too easy these days.........

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Strangely Brown
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Re: Driving Test Changes

Postby Strangely Brown » Wed Apr 26, 2017 1:53 pm

GTR1400MAN wrote:
Strangely Brown wrote:
martine wrote:
Mr Cholmondeley-Warner wrote:... and, Mr ADI, what is a UK flash supposed to mean... ?

Legally or in common use?


What would be the expected interpretation on test?

Surely the same as the rest of us?


I would argue that the expected behaviour on test would be that described in the highway code.

Yes, I am acutely aware that "context is everything" but the situation described is a perfect example of how "common use" leads to problems. We all know what a headlamp flash means: "I am here!". That is all. No more, no less and a decision to proceed on the strength of one must be made very carefully and, I would suggest, only with further supporting evidence that the inferred invitation was actually for you.

Highway Code Rule 111 wrote:Never assume that flashing headlights is a signal inviting you to proceed. Use your own judgement and proceed carefully.


I believe the point being made is that the candidate should not have moved when flashed, especially since the oncoming vehicle was still moving.

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Strangely Brown
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Re: Driving Test Changes

Postby Strangely Brown » Wed Apr 26, 2017 1:54 pm

crr003 wrote:#111 tells you what to do when dealing with normal drivers who flash.


Yes, exactly. See previous post.

sussex2
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Re: Driving Test Changes

Postby sussex2 » Wed Apr 26, 2017 2:32 pm

Likewise I suppose the 'practice' of vehicles joining a motorway or dual-carriageway almost assuming people will move over for them.
It's a particularly UK thing and I rarely see it elsewhere I drive (mostly in other European countries)and it is certainly not expected.

crr003
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Re: Driving Test Changes

Postby crr003 » Wed Apr 26, 2017 3:00 pm

Strangely Brown wrote:I believe the point being made is that the candidate should not have moved when flashed, especially since the oncoming vehicle was still moving.

So, if you were the Examiner, would you have failed Jaryd for a Serious/Dangerous fault?
There must be some disconnect if the real Examiner couldn't even manage a Driving Fault? Jaryd slowed to afford priority, oncomer flashed (and implied slowed down as Martin then said he accelerated (unless he's got dad's rose coloured glasses on!)), Jaryd didn't hit him or get dualled. That's life.

Martin - did you have a roof box on?

martine
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Re: Driving Test Changes

Postby martine » Wed Apr 26, 2017 4:06 pm

crr003 wrote:Martin - did you have a roof box on?

No, I prefer a trilby.
Martin - Bristol IAM: IMI National Observer and Group Secretary, DSA: ADI, Fleet, RoSPA (Dip)

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Horse
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Re: Driving Test Changes

Postby Horse » Wed Apr 26, 2017 4:29 pm

crr003 wrote: In the old days you had to find a switch on the floor with your left foot (so grand dad told me). Everything's too easy these days.........


Is it in John Miles' 'Expert Driving the Police Way' where he recounts being on a night drive with a trainee who was doing perfect smooth double declutching, while dipping and raising the headlamps with each gear change . . . :? ;)
My own views. For better or worse :)

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Strangely Brown
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Re: Driving Test Changes

Postby Strangely Brown » Wed Apr 26, 2017 4:50 pm

crr003 wrote:
Strangely Brown wrote:I believe the point being made is that the candidate should not have moved when flashed, especially since the oncoming vehicle was still moving.

So, if you were the Examiner, would you have failed Jaryd for a Serious/Dangerous fault?
There must be some disconnect if the real Examiner couldn't even manage a Driving Fault? Jaryd slowed to afford priority, oncomer flashed (and implied slowed down as Martin then said he accelerated (unless he's got dad's rose coloured glasses on!)), Jaryd didn't hit him or get dualled. That's life.


We are well into the realm of discussing something where I wasn't present so I can only go on the details presented in the posts.

martine wrote:The oncoming driver flashed their lights but then came through the gap without stopping - it's not as if Jaryd was hesitant.


Given that the oncomer did not stop (you inferred slowed) and that Jaryd was "not hesitant", it strikes me that it was a 50/50 confusion as to who was intending to stop for whom. The only people who know exactly what happened were the people in the car and text on a forum is a fantastically poor medium to explain the situation.

Would I have failed him? Based on the details as presented, no. If it was a mistake then, IMO, it is not the fact that it was made that is important, rather it is how the mistake was dealt with and whether it had any ongoing affect on the drive.

Whatever happened the situation was dealt with to the examiner's satisfaction and everyone has come away happy. That there is a valuable lesson learned as well is just a bonus.


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