Routes into Advanced Driving?

Topics relating to Advanced Driving in cars
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GTR1400MAN
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Re: Routes into Advanced Driving?

Postby GTR1400MAN » Thu Dec 22, 2016 5:23 pm

Certainly in our group any observer using the words "You need to do this on test" would be beaten severely. :hit:

I'm sure there is the odd occurrence but all our observer training emphasises preparing people for everyday riding. The test is just a step along the road.

Sadly many do just 'get the badge' and disappear but you have to hope and believe their time with us has influenced their riding for ever.
Mike Roberts - Now riding a Triumph Explorer XRT. My username comes from my 50K miles on a Kawasaki 1400GTR, after many years on Hondas of various shapes and styles. - https://tinyurl.com/mikerobertsonyoutube

martine
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Re: Routes into Advanced Driving?

Postby martine » Thu Dec 22, 2016 5:39 pm

GTR1400MAN wrote:Certainly in our group any observer using the words "You need to do this on test" would be beaten severely. :hit:


There are some folk who would pay for that... :shock:
Martin - Bristol Advanced Motorists: IMI National Observer, Group Secretary, Masters (dist), DSA: ADI, Fleet, RoSPA (Dip)

waremark
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Re: Routes into Advanced Driving?

Postby waremark » Thu Dec 22, 2016 7:33 pm

martine wrote:
GTR1400MAN wrote:Certainly in our group any observer using the words "You need to do this on test" would be beaten severely. :hit:


There are some folk who would pay for that... :shock:

I am a bit confused about what you mean Martin. Are you thinking Max Mosley?

crr003
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Re: Routes into Advanced Driving?

Postby crr003 » Thu Dec 22, 2016 7:57 pm

Horse wrote:I'd rather only teach useful, justifiable, content. I can't see any point in teaching (or learning, for that matter) content simply to pass a test.

I'd like to think we all think we do that. Are all the Observers/Tutors in a position to be sure of that though? I'm sure if we looked hard enough we could find Groups/individuals teaching some currently discouraged content/techniques.

Why do people want a pass? I know of an Associate who wanted an IAM test pass to allow him to drive official cars at a golf competition - not sure the syllabus was going to change his driving in the long term. Sometimes one hears of ADIs wanting an IAM/RoADAR pass to further their business.

Horse wrote:
crr003 wrote: That's how I got my ADI badge


That's hardly a good example :lol: :hit: :drool:

Maybe not, but I had to change my driving to accommodate the test, even after receiving perfectly justifiable and useful content from an IAM and RoADAR teacher. :car:

crr003
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Re: Routes into Advanced Driving?

Postby crr003 » Thu Dec 22, 2016 8:05 pm

GTR1400MAN wrote:Certainly in our group any observer using the words "You need to do this on test" would be beaten severely. :hit:

Oh how times have changed!

I'm looking at my old Observer Training Manual page 5:
"........The other option (when all else fails) is to explain to the Associate that this is what is expected for the Test and that they should accept that......."

God Bless the Standards Team!

martine
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Re: Routes into Advanced Driving?

Postby martine » Fri Dec 23, 2016 10:42 am

waremark wrote:I am a bit confused about what you mean Martin. Are you thinking Max Mosley?

Yes :lol:
Martin - Bristol Advanced Motorists: IMI National Observer, Group Secretary, Masters (dist), DSA: ADI, Fleet, RoSPA (Dip)

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Mr Cholmondeley-Warner
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Re: Routes into Advanced Driving?

Postby Mr Cholmondeley-Warner » Fri Dec 23, 2016 6:43 pm

martine wrote:ROSPA is cheaper but not hugely so bearing in mind the IAM's £149 covers:
  • membership to both the national organisation and a local group
  • the course manual
  • and the test itself
There are many more IAM groups than ROSPA across the UK but when it comes down to it, pick whichever is closest to make initial enquiries, perhaps attend a local meeting and then decide if you're happy with the vibe.

To address this piece of rather optimistic arithmetic, if you join Wiltshire RoSPA it will cost you a total of £90 - £30 to join the group and £60 for the test (that's 60% of the IAM fee - just over half, to use a similar approximation to Martin's :mrgreen: )

You get "the course manual" (actually a copy of Roadcraft, generally acknowledged to be a superior publication until the IAM recently revamped their literature, open to debate now) included in the £30. You also get (obviously) membership of the local group, and membership of RoSPA nationally is included in the test fee, for the first year.

Apart from that, there are indeed more IAM groups.

Hope this helps.
Nick

hir
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Re: Routes into Advanced Driving?

Postby hir » Sat Dec 24, 2016 9:08 am

crr003 wrote:
GTR1400MAN wrote:Certainly in our group any observer using the words "You need to do this on test" would be beaten severely. :hit:

Oh how times have changed!

I'm looking at my old Observer Training Manual page 5:
"........The other option (when all else fails) is to explain to the Associate that this is what is expected for the Test and that they should accept that......."

God Bless the Standards Team!


I take a pragmatic view on this topic. Having been an observer for many years it occasionally happens that, having patiently explained the reasoning behind the theory many, many times, I have had to... explain to the Associate that this is what is expected for the Test and that ... it's their choice to do whatever they wish to do......."

I consider that, having failed to persuade the associate of the efficacy of whatever it is that the IAM or RoSPA are advocating, it is incumbent upon me to point out the above. I don't want the associate, having failed the test, saying to me afterwards... "if you'd told me I would fail the test for doing/not doing that I would have done it differently".

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Horse
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Re: Routes into Advanced Driving?

Postby Horse » Sat Dec 24, 2016 10:02 am

The key point, surely, is that the specific actions (style, call it what you will ) have to be of long-term benefit to the candidates otherwise they can't be expected to maintain it beyond the moment when the examiner gives the verdict.

See today's post by Easyshifter in 'Pitching' for examples.
Your 'standard' is how you drive alone, not how you drive during a test.


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