Horse wrote:Have a look at the picture! It's in a village, a stone wall about 8' high, 'vehicle'-sized aperture with huge fuggoff wrought iron gates just visible, with a nice weed-free gravel driveway. The wall is set back no more than a metre from the edge of the road.
In other words, it would be reasonable to expect a Range Rover to emerge. And, as you can see, the Range would have to nose out for the driver to get any view.
So what? You ask.
Well,
1. The picture is to show us the limit point, so if we're concentrating on that and planning for the right hand bend, then where would we position for view?
2. Yes, I do bang on about the SH. And this is a classic example of where someone has progressed to a very high standard of driving - but can still apparently be blissfully unaware. So what do you suggest, that I shut up, encouraging that blissful ignorance?
It just depends what one means by Limit Point.
Definition: The Limit Point is the furthest distance on the surface of the road seen to be clear and likely to remain so.
This isn't a totally satisfactory or useful definition when looking at the photo of the church. If I've understood correctly, the question that seems to be at issue in this discussion is... is the Limit Point in front of the church, or at the point of the entrance on the left? Some say it can't be at the church because something might pop out of the entrance, so therefore the entrance should be regarded as the true Limit Point, others will say the Limit Point is in front of the church because that's the furthest distance on the surface of the road seen to be clear. The point indicated in front of the church is what I would regard as the physical limit point, in accordance with the first part of the definition. But, as Horse quite rightly points out, there is an entrance on the left with a restricted view into that entrance. And this is where I think we begin to get hung up about Limit Points and trying to define where the Limit Point is. I don't think the term "Surprise Horizon" is a particularly helpful term to use in this context because it confuses the distinction between a "hazard" to be dealt with by IPSGA and the Limit Point which is a technique to get our approach and entry speed correct for a bend.
However, I think we can cut through all of this pointless "is it, isn't it" debate if we regard the church as the physical Limit Point and we then apply IPSGA (not Limit Point Technique) to the potential hazard associated with the entrance on our left. Dealing with the entrance on our left as a hazard in its own right [something might pop out without stopping] means that we should be dealing with it by applying the System, maybe by moving offside to move the car to a place of safety or, if that's not possible, reducing speed to be able to deal with any surprises [ie. IPSGA, pure and simple]. When the entrance on the left is passed and has been safely dealt with we can revert to dealing with the limit point in front of the church and, if appropriate, adjusting our speed in accordance with whatever the Limit Point is telling us.
So, if my understanding of how the term "Surprise Horizon" is being used in this context, then, in my opinion, the entrance on the left is not a "Surprise Horizon", a term which seems to be related to Limit Points, but is in fact simply a "potential hazard" to be dealt with by IPSGA in a similar way to any other hazard.