IAM RoADAR is a punishment

Anything that doesn't fit elsewhere - doesn't have to be AD related.
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akirk
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Re: IAM RoADAR is a punishment

Postby akirk » Wed Oct 12, 2016 1:08 pm

The other thing to note is that the biggest issue with drivers and how they drive is very simply: selfishness or viewed another way, lack of self awareness...

whether it is bumbling along a country road at 40 and then continuing at 40 through a village / or sitting in the middle lane of the motorway at 65mph / or pulling out from a minor road, taking no notice of others on the road / etc. etc.

has anyone ever successfully manage to persuade the whole population to be more self-aware / less selfish?! :D

Alasdair

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Horse
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Re: IAM RoADAR is a punishment

Postby Horse » Wed Oct 12, 2016 9:09 pm

Drink-driving, from the 70s to now, reduction in smoking since law changes, equality/disability/discrimination etc.

Sadly, all 'driven' by laws.
My own views. For better or worse :)

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EasyShifter
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Re: IAM RoADAR is a punishment

Postby EasyShifter » Wed Oct 26, 2016 7:22 am

I does seem strange that so many people complain of not enjoying driving and yet advanced driving is not perceived as a way of addressing that. If I have to do something every day and I find it stressful, then surely finding a way of making it at least tolerable if not enjoyable is worth trying?
Another possibility - that I've recently suggested to IAM Roadsmart in an email but await a response - is to try and appeal to the large number of drivers (and their employers/managers) whose work routinely requires them to make progress safely but without the exemptions of emergency service drivers. There are many such drivers in, for example, the NHS, Social Services and other areas where urgent needs arise and community staff attend in their own vehicles, often under real pressure to get there quickly.
I was one of those staff (community mental health) and as far as I'm aware none of the others I knew had done any advanced training - but the skill of maximising legal and safe progress certainly stood me in good stead on numerous drives through town and country to attend patients in urgent need.
A course such as this would obviously look at the planning and anticipation aspects, but also the human factors like red mist and noble cause risk taking.
I can't help thinking that the IAM and RoADAR should be exploring areas such as that as part of their workplace training packages.
Michael

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EasyShifter
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Re: IAM RoADAR is a punishment

Postby EasyShifter » Wed Oct 26, 2016 7:26 am

jont- wrote:
WhoseGeneration wrote:
waremark wrote:Safer and more enjoyable driving - but difficult going on impossible to prove, and not a perceived need by most.


Yet needed by most, frustrates me, for just proper observation and that 2 second rule (for pedants, to be extended in poor conditions) obeyed by all, would lead to fewer collisions.

And improved lane discipline would increase the capacity of our major routes, particularly dual carriageways.

Basic AD skills if widely adopted could reduce or even eliminate the 'shock-waving' that causes so many long, stationary queues on motorways that are caused by drivers who are too close over-reacting to changes of speed and starting a chain reaction.
Michael

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akirk
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Re: IAM RoADAR is a punishment

Postby akirk » Wed Oct 26, 2016 7:56 am

EasyShifter wrote:I does seem strange that so many people complain of not enjoying driving and yet advanced driving is not perceived as a way of addressing that. If I have to do something every day and I find it stressful, then surely finding a way of making it at least tolerable if not enjoyable is worth trying?
Another possibility - that I've recently suggested to IAM Roadsmart in an email but await a response - is to try and appeal to the large number of drivers (and their employers/managers) whose work routinely requires them to make progress safely but without the exemptions of emergency service drivers. There are many such drivers in, for example, the NHS, Social Services and other areas where urgent needs arise and community staff attend in their own vehicles, often under real pressure to get there quickly.
I was one of those staff (community mental health) and as far as I'm aware none of the others I knew had done any advanced training - but the skill of maximising legal and safe progress certainly stood me in good stead on numerous drives through town and country to attend patients in urgent need.
A course such as this would obviously look at the planning and anticipation aspects, but also the human factors like red mist and noble cause risk taking.
I can't help thinking that the IAM and RoADAR should be exploring areas such as that as part of their workplace training packages.


everything you say here makes sense...

but...

it just doesn't gel with current perception and thinking:
- speed is seen as evil - the very fact that we have twisted the English language so that speed / speeding is seen as a negative word - to have negative connotations - in reality, if I am driving at 3 mph I have speed / am utilising speed (speeding) - the correct use of the word has been ditched to give a very strong negative which makes it difficult to reclaim the word...
- so we use the word progress instead as a way of communicating our philosophy - but that has issues in that it implies priority / making progress at the cost of others making progress - and sounds selfish and entitled...

I think that is why the IAM is rapidly moving to an organisation which is all about road safety as it feels that it is the only thing it can talk about out in the open - if you look at their facebook posts it is all about winter tyres and car mechanics and driving safely - totally and completely dumbed down - yes, those are valid, but virtually nothing in their current stream of social media is promoting actual advanced driving - there is very little on observation leading to being able to manage the road better / to handling corners better / to making better progress...

It is a very defensive attitude - advanced driving is now becoming about not crashing / avoiding issues - rather than pushing forwards skills etc. - hence the big change to ADUK ownership... Personally I don't see that as being the correct angle for IAM - but it seems that they are going that way in their public brand / profile - and they are increasing their 'driver training' while annoying their traditional membership etc. - in 10 years, will they simply be a commercial driver training organisation rather than an AD charity? Very possible!

Alasdair

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Horse
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Re: IAM RoADAR is a punishment

Postby Horse » Wed Oct 26, 2016 8:25 am

EasyShifter wrote:I does seem strange that so many people complain of not enjoying driving and yet advanced driving is not perceived as a way of addressing that. If I have to do something every day and I find it stressful, then surely finding a way of making it at least tolerable if not enjoyable is worth trying?

http://www.standard.co.uk/lifestyle/mot ... 93116.html
https://www.iamroadsmart.com/docs/defau ... f?sfvrsn=4
My own views. For better or worse :)

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GTR1400MAN
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Re: IAM RoADAR is a punishment

Postby GTR1400MAN » Wed Oct 26, 2016 10:02 am

Horse wrote:
EasyShifter wrote:I does seem strange that so many people complain of not enjoying driving and yet advanced driving is not perceived as a way of addressing that. If I have to do something every day and I find it stressful, then surely finding a way of making it at least tolerable if not enjoyable is worth trying?

http://www.standard.co.uk/lifestyle/mot ... 93116.html
https://www.iamroadsmart.com/docs/defau ... f?sfvrsn=4

Or ...

Ogri - "Stuff everything - I've always got my bike!" (image to big too embed)

Image

Strangely I'm very relaxed, calm and take everything in my stride on my bike. In the car I admit I do feel more frustrated/annoyed by what happens on the road around me. I've not fully worked out why.
Mike Roberts

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ChristianAB
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Re: IAM RoADAR is a punishment

Postby ChristianAB » Fri Jan 06, 2017 12:11 pm

What car do you drive? That may have something to do with it...

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GTR1400MAN
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Re: IAM RoADAR is a punishment

Postby GTR1400MAN » Fri Jan 06, 2017 1:38 pm

Renault Clio Renaultsport 200 EDC Dual clutch/Petrol
Toyota Yaris Manual/Petrol
Fiat Multipla DieselManual with right hand hand brake (converted to allow rear wheelchair access for the passenger)
Suzuki Ignis Auto/Petrol

Not sure it's the vehicle, just a something I've noticed and can't put my finger on.
Mike Roberts

Matt1962
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Re: IAM RoADAR is a punishment

Postby Matt1962 » Fri Jan 06, 2017 7:20 pm

GTR1400MAN wrote:Renault Clio Renaultsport 200 EDC Dual clutch/Petrol
Toyota Yaris Manual/Petrol
Fiat Multipla DieselManual with right hand hand brake (converted to allow rear wheelchair access for the passenger)
Suzuki Ignis Auto/Petrol

Not sure it's the vehicle, just a something I've noticed and can't put my finger on.


It's a long while since I rode (motor) bikes but I can remember the same lack of stress, compared with car driving. I think there are several reasons:

1. You never really sit at junctions for long because you have enough acceleration to jump into almost any gap.
2. Overtaking always seems easier - acceleration + the (sometimes misguided) feeling that you could always go between cars if it all went pear shaped.
3. Parking
4. The possibility of filtering means you are unlikely to ever be stuck in stationary traffic for long, so you know when you are going to arrive somewhere even on the M25 or going to Cornwall on a bank holiday!


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