The EU - Leave or Remain?

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Rolyan
Posts: 635
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2016 5:45 pm

Re: The EU - Leave or Remain?

Postby Rolyan » Sat Jun 25, 2016 10:50 pm

Keithrm wrote:
Strangely Brown wrote:
I thought that there wasn't much that could shock me but I am really quite appalled at the extent of the desire to ignore the democratic process.



so am I, can't remember how many times the vote went against my preference but that's democracy, I certainly didn't throw my toys out and start asking for it to be done again

Exactly. The remainers were quite happy with the referendum when they thought they would win it. Having lost, they now think they should call another referendum with different rules.

Very silly, and it won't happen.

Rolyan
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Re: The EU - Leave or Remain?

Postby Rolyan » Sat Jun 25, 2016 10:55 pm

Silk wrote:I see all the lefties have started a petition to re-run it.

No, that's incorrect.

You've seen some remainers starting a petition to re run it. Some of them are left wing and some are right wing.

Many left wingers voted to leave.

LenWoodman55
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Re: The EU - Leave or Remain?

Postby LenWoodman55 » Sun Jun 26, 2016 12:51 am

I've only just opened this after a few weeks away. I think this has been a most interesting discussion. I haven't seen anything as good anywhere else. I am serious on this. To me it's interesting that a site for conscientious drivers has so much value in general discussion. Perhaps it's because of a common thread that we are all generally self-assessing our abilities whilst undertaking a commonly considered simple task - driving. This influences much of our other thoughts. There will be some that argue that it is the other way round - our approach to life affects our driving!

I'm here in Australia where many are concerned as to how Brexit might affect them - at least visits to the UK will be cheaper if the pound continues to slump!

Len

TripleS
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Re: The EU - Leave or Remain?

Postby TripleS » Sun Jun 26, 2016 4:04 am

Whenever I have made references to freedom and independence, it wasn't in the expectation that we would achieve these in full measure, i.e. complete freedom and independence, but I do feel that we have been losing more than we should. I don't think it is just me either: it sounds as if this feeling exists quite strongly within the electorate as a whole.

I am seriously concerned by these stories that the result might be ignored, or we might, after all, end up with a few concessions from the EU and not leave after all. To my mind that would mean we 've had a great deal of upset and achieved nothing of value at the end of it.

No doubt it will be a long and complex business extricating ourselves from the EU, but to my mind it is what needs to be done.

Rolyan
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Re: The EU - Leave or Remain?

Postby Rolyan » Sun Jun 26, 2016 8:03 am

TripleS wrote: No doubt it will be a long and complex business extricating ourselves from the EU, but to my mind it is what needs to be done.

The majority of those voting agreed with you. David Cameron is on record as saying that if it's a vote out, it's out. If it's a vote in, it's in. Obviously he's going, but it's highly unlikely that others will now change it to "if it's a vote out, it's a few changes and another referendum and actually stay in".

Many of us voted to leave to ensure that we can vote out those who let us down. Clegg and the Lib Dems learnt this the hard way; I'm sure they are reflecting on the student grant and coalition fiasco from the wilderness and will do so for many years.

Tim Faron said that he was voting to remain because he was a patriot and a parent. The soundbite failed in its intended purpose, as he failed to realise the strength of feeling amongst many other patriots and parents who wanted to leave.

Anyone who ignored that strength of feeling and ignored the democratic process may find themselves camping out with Clegg in the wilderness. In the meantime, the remainers on both sides should be reviewing how they misjudged it so badly and how they managed to misunderstand the leavers so much. I'm glad that the leavers won, but the remainers helped that win by dismissing the leavers; the remainers should have a period of quiet reflection and introspection to help them get back in touch with so many who have felt ignored and dismissed for so long.

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Strangely Brown
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Location: Sussex

Re: The EU - Leave or Remain?

Postby Strangely Brown » Sun Jun 26, 2016 9:08 am

TheInsanity1234 wrote:*sigh*

Well.

I'll apologise for the way I've conducted myself.

I will not apologise for...


[remainder of rant trimmed]

You think that comes across as a mature apology? Sounds exactly like more of the same to me.

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Strangely Brown
Posts: 590
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Location: Sussex

Re: The EU - Leave or Remain?

Postby Strangely Brown » Sun Jun 26, 2016 9:12 am

LenWoodman55 wrote:I've only just opened this after a few weeks away. I think this has been a most interesting discussion. I haven't seen anything as good anywhere else. I am serious on this. To me it's interesting that a site for conscientious drivers has so much value in general discussion. Perhaps it's because of a common thread that we are all generally self-assessing our abilities whilst undertaking a commonly considered simple task - driving. This influences much of our other thoughts. There will be some that argue that it is the other way round - our approach to life affects our driving!


Who you are is how you drive. </Don>

chriskay
Posts: 112
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Location: Shrewsbury

Re: The EU - Leave or Remain?

Postby chriskay » Sun Jun 26, 2016 12:23 pm

TheInsanity1234 wrote:*sigh*

Well.

I'll apologise for the way I've conducted myself.



No need to apologise; we'll just put it down to immaturity.
If more of your young friends had bothered to get off their arses and vote, I'm sure the result would have been different.
I speak as someone who's approaching eighty and who voted to remain. I doubt I'll be around long enough to feel the final effects.
Oh, how big would the majority need to be for you not to consider it "marginal"?
Carpe diem

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akirk
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Location: Cotswolds

Re: The EU - Leave or Remain?

Postby akirk » Sun Jun 26, 2016 1:49 pm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_c ... on_results
for marginal results - votes with a 1 / 2 / 4 / etc. difference
the margin on Thursday was over 45,000% greater!

Alasdair

chriskay
Posts: 112
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2015 2:08 pm
Location: Shrewsbury

Re: The EU - Leave or Remain?

Postby chriskay » Sun Jun 26, 2016 2:39 pm

Thanks for that link Alasdair: now those are what I class as marginal, certainly not the 4% in the referendum.
Carpe diem


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