Ban on Government funding for lobbying

[michael769]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-35509117

I wonder it this may impact everyone's favourite "road safety" chairy?

[akirk]

Only if government funds...
Fair changes, gov. funds are not given for lobbying...

Alasdair

[jont-]

Fair changes, gov. funds are not given for lobbying...

Nor should charitable donations be. And what does gift aid count as?

[Horse]

As an aside, I found it interesting when David Cameron announced his 'Big Society' idea - then promptly cut funding to councils with the expectation that charities would take over much work. Without seeming to know that councils funded charities?

[Mr Cholmondeley-Warner]

I'm firmly behind this. I don't give money to charities with the expectation that it should be used for political lobbying. I certainly don't expect to pay taxes to have them used by organisations who may or may not share my views for their own political purposes. I don't see charity as meaning "campaigning" anyway. If you want to form a political pressure group, then by all means do so. Like-minded people will support your cause if they feel it appropriate. But don't call yourself a "charity".

and ... breathe ...

[martine]

Fair changes, gov. funds are not given for lobbying...

Nor should charitable donations be. And what does gift aid count as?

I agree government money *shouldn't be used for lobbying government but why shouldn't donations from the public? If I support a charity's aims, then I would expect it to promote and 'lobby' anyone and everyone.

Does Brake get any government money (apart from Gift Aid)?

[michael769]

I agree government money *shouldn't be used for lobbying government but why shouldn't donations from the public? If I support a charity's aims, then I would expect it to promote and 'lobby' anyone and everyone.

I've no problems with the idea of organisations wishing to lobby the government receiving donations from the public (political parties receive a lot of funding this way), but I am uncomfortable with the idea of tax breaks for what is, in effect playing politics.

No problem with charities responding to consultations that directly impact their activities, but beyond that if they wish to lobby government they should not be subsidized in doing so by taxpayers.

I do not expect the public as a whole (via the tax system) to be forced to fund people or organisations who promote my views any more that I wish to fund the promotion of views I do not agree with.

Does Brake get any government money (apart from Gift Aid)?

Yes they receive funding from the Ministry of Justice, Scottish Government and Police Service of Northern Ireland.

I don't give money to charities with the expectation that it should be used for political lobbying.

Quite if I denote money in the expectation that it may help something/someone I do not expect it to be squandered taking politicians to lunch or buying space in newspapers. I have largely stopped donating to national/international charities (in favour of locally based charities) due to this, along with the increasing tendency of large charities to be run on a business footing (with salaries and advertising budgets to match).

[Mr Cholmondeley-Warner]

I agree government money *shouldn't be used for lobbying government but why shouldn't donations from the public? If I support a charity's aims, then I would expect it to promote and 'lobby' anyone and everyone.

Does Brake get any government money (apart from Gift Aid)?

Under the new conditions , which only apply to grants from central UK government departments, organisations will not be able to use grants for "activity intended to influence - or attempt to influence - Parliament, government or political parties".

However charities will still be able to use privately-raised funds to campaign as they like.

So it is just about Government money. Of course, the difficult bit will be working out which funds have been used for what, as the rest of the article argues.

[martine]

Michael:
Interesting points.

Can you tell me more about the money Brake gets from the MoJ - is this 'victim support' grants?

The potential lobbying 'tax subsidy' via Gift aid is not something I can personally get excited about...it's a small proportion of a small proportion - charities, by definition, are 'for the public good' and the majority of charities are run almost entirely by volunteers. It might be the principle you object to - which I quite understand. I suppose the HMRC could reduce the gift aid in direct proportion to a charity's expenditure on 'lobbying' - if a suitable definition could be made.

Re your parting comment about charities run as a business by highly paid senior management...I think it's only right they are able to attract the best to run a multi-million £ organisation - the large UK charities are very large indeed (Cancer Research, Oxfam etc). Do you think they would provide better 'public benefit' being run by less expensive 'second-string' managers or entirely by volunteers?

[akirk]

Re your parting comment about charities run as a business by highly paid senior management...I think it's only right they are able to attract the best to run a multi-million £ organisation - the large UK charities are very large indeed (Cancer Research, Oxfam etc). Do you think they would provide better 'public benefit' being run by less expensive 'second-string' managers or entirely by volunteers?

while at a slight tangent, this is an interesting area of debate...
the large charities would argue that it is about % spend, not absolute spend - so, they might spend 1% on overheads (v. 5% - 15% in a smaller charity), yet the actual overheads spend could be in the millions - the charity feels they are managing really well, yet the critics focus on the large number and criticise them - a difficult one, but in general charities in the UK are run really efficiently... while it is valid to ask about spend on political lobbying, I think that where a charity is sound (unlike some recent high profile news!) then the overhead spend is usually not too bad...

Alasdair