New ST drifts itself.

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Adamxck
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New ST drifts itself.

Postby Adamxck » Thu Jan 21, 2016 6:09 pm

Not quite, but apparently alongside your usual 'comfy', 'sporty', 'dsc off-but-not-really' modes, the new RS comes with a 'drift' mode which allows talentless monkeys to believe they can drift. (I'm a talentless monkey who knows he can't drift, buts that's half the point.)

It's 4wd and has the capability to send 70% of the drive rearward, along with torque vectoring which can send up to 100% of torque left to right. There is also some clever differy going on. A man explains things in not much detail, but better than I can, starting at 5:28 in this (terrible) review. https://youtu.be/rtuqPAkl-SY?t=5m28s

I admit it's not completely foolproof, but it does appear to give a high degree of assistance. I have visions of the target demographic both drifting on the public road in their shiny new RS, overconfident that they won't balls it up, and the more worrying side effect of instilling in them a belief that they can drift anything and then trying it, with potentially fatal consequence.

There are a lot of threads about actual self driving cars and their problems, but I find this more worrying as it is available for sale right now (well, pre order) and actually encourages hooliganism. They'll say it's track only in the brochure, but we all know there will be those that won't care, they may actually buy one in order to increase their 'watch this' cred.

Do I have a valid concern, or am I just particularly miserable today?
Last edited by Adamxck on Thu Jan 21, 2016 7:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Adam.

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akirk
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Re: New ST drifts itself.

Postby akirk » Thu Jan 21, 2016 6:23 pm

I would agree with you - there is a very interesting bit of legal history just over the horizon on the occasion of the first accident where Ford are sued because they put in an option to destabalise the car...

very valid concern

Alasdair

WhoseGeneration
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Re: New ST drifts itself.

Postby WhoseGeneration » Thu Jan 21, 2016 7:08 pm

Ahem, it's the RS not the ST. One does wonder though when deliveries might commence.
I would suspect that Ford's legal team will ensure that the manual will cover idiots and their potential antics.
Lots of stuff with track mode, launch control and "oh shIt" potential.
Read the owner's manual for any car and it's full of safe operation guidelines. Test most owners on their manual and they'd not know much about the detail.

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Adamxck
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Re: New ST drifts itself.

Postby Adamxck » Thu Jan 21, 2016 7:44 pm

RS it is.

What I didn't mention, which is the sad part, is that the manufacturers are yet again putting technology in that will diminish driver skill.

Id love to learn to drift. Pressing the 'go' pedal to the floor and arbitrarily doing some steering while the car balances itself is not what I'd call an achievement, or fun.

It might be fun actually, for a bit.
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martine
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Re: New ST drifts itself.

Postby martine » Fri Jan 22, 2016 11:08 am

I agree it's a potentially dangerous tweak...but like anything, it depends on the attitude of the driver. The 'drift' setting is meant for track use only but that won't stop some of course.

On my last Driver Alertness course one of my candidates had written off his car by drifting on the road...hit a kerb hard and lost it. He agreed he won't be doing that again. Fortunately no one was hurt. Perhaps this setting should be like the clever Nissan GTR that only allows certain settings to be activated off-road (using GPS).
Martin - Bristol Advanced Motorists: IMI National Observer, Group Secretary, Masters (dist), DSA: ADI, Fleet, RoSPA (Dip)

Synchromesh

Re: New ST drifts itself.

Postby Synchromesh » Fri Jan 22, 2016 4:57 pm

Adamxck wrote:What I didn't mention, which is the sad part, is that the manufacturers are yet again putting technology in that will diminish driver skill.

Id love to learn to drift. Pressing the 'go' pedal to the floor and arbitrarily doing some steering while the car balances itself is not what I'd call an achievement, or fun.

This. A drift mode defeats the whole point of drifting for me, which is the satisfaction of getting it right.

Tbh I can't see the mode encouraging people to drift any more than having a RWD car encourages people to drift. In both situations the ability is there, but it's at the discretion of the driver as to whether and where they actually choose to do it.

Regarding learning to drift, you already have the right car. All you need to do is book yourself onto a wet airfield day have a play. Start by provoking little slides and catching them (tip: it's about getting the lock OFF quick enough to avoid a 'tankslapper'), then try and hold them out for a bit longer. By the end of the day you'll have it sussed :)

/awaits forum grumpies to tell me how silly I am drifting on a track day, but if there's no one around you to hit if you get it wrong I don't see the problem. Better than trying to learn to drift on the road at least.

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StressedDave
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Re: New ST drifts itself.

Postby StressedDave » Fri Jan 22, 2016 5:32 pm

Synchromesh wrote:/awaits forum grumpies to tell me how silly I am drifting on a track day, but if there's no one around you to hit if you get it wrong I don't see the problem. Better than trying to learn to drift on the road at least.

Unless there are issues with you a) making too much noise and awakening the grumpy noise meters and b) holding up others because you're going really, really slowly all crossed up, then I don't see it as silly. It is clearly safer than practising out on the open road.

I learnt to drift using a soaking wet portland stone/ basalt tile roundabout (MIRA's wet grip facility) but there's nothing like that freely available out there for anyone other than the fabulously rich. Ten years ago, the hourly hire cost for the wet grip was £240+vat and you were only allowed solo use. I did then get a track day in a location that had 2 inches of snow atop an inch of sheet ice. At one point we had three cars (me in a cheap one and two 911s) in echelon drifts. I think there's a video out there somewhere showing it later in the day when it was slushy and I got to overtake a Carerra GT.

As for the ST, I think it's a gimmick that won't actually do much. It'll just give a different attitude to the car (a drift is just as stable as any other cornering manoeuvre - it's normally the entry to and exit from that requires the talent) and a sense of metal testicles to the driver.

PS - found it: http://www.trackvision.net//gallery/DaveSnow.wmv
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Synchromesh

Re: New ST drifts itself.

Postby Synchromesh » Fri Jan 22, 2016 6:40 pm

StressedDave wrote:
Synchromesh wrote:/awaits forum grumpies to tell me how silly I am drifting on a track day, but if there's no one around you to hit if you get it wrong I don't see the problem. Better than trying to learn to drift on the road at least.

Unless there are issues with you a) making too much noise and awakening the grumpy noise meters and b) holding up others because you're going really, really slowly all crossed up, then I don't see it as silly. It is clearly safer than practising out on the open road.

I think those points are covered by the bits where I specified a) a wet TD (no tyre squeal) and b) no one behind you. If I want to do skiddy stuff I'll let everyone past on the straight so I'm not distracted by what's in my mirrors in the corners :)

P.s. I was hoping the linked video would be of your aforementioned 'echelon drifts' (or as the drift boys call it, twinning) - always great to watch!

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StressedDave
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Re: New ST drifts itself.

Postby StressedDave » Fri Jan 22, 2016 7:00 pm

I was lead car in the echelon so there wouldn't have been much to see
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waremark
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Re: New ST drifts itself.

Postby waremark » Fri Jan 22, 2016 7:10 pm

StressedDave wrote:PS - found it: http://www.trackvision.net//gallery/DaveSnow.wmv

Very disappointing, was looking forward to some nice driftery. I think that on that day I missed out on the fun. If I am thinking of the right day, after a few brake tests on the snow I decided that the max safe speed was 20 mph, and after 10 miles at 20 mph I turned round and went home. I had 4wd but unsuitable tyres. In recent years I have fitted suitable tyres, so we have not had any snow to let me play with them. Any chance of snow in the south-east before the end of the winter?


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