Winter to summer tires

Technology in driving is becoming more dominant...
User avatar
akirk
Posts: 1480
Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2015 6:58 pm
Location: Cotswolds

Re: Winter to summer tires

Postby akirk » Fri Apr 01, 2016 12:03 pm

jont- wrote:As for buying more tyres - moot point. You're not wearing out the summer tyres when the winters are on. For the clio I bought a s/h set of alloys which I can probably sell on for what I paid when I get rid of the car.


that can vary - with lots of people on leases it is not inconceivable that on a one year / two year lease the tyres will not need replacing - so there is an extra cost... with inclusive leases where tyres are a part of the built in cost, I don't believe that would include winter tyres and switching...

then there is the cost of switching the tyres over - assuming no second set of wheels which would be a big cost - at anything from c. £40 - £80 for four wheels - twice a year - and if you do the spare as well (assuming you have one!) then that adds a little bit more

then the storage costs - some folks won't have space at home - so the garage might store the spare tyres / wheels for them - but are likely to charge...

it can add up - many households might have 2-4 cars if they have young adults at home - that could be £400 / £500 a year extra...

Gareth wrote:One of my friends in a hilly part of the Cotswolds - a long-term advanced driver - used to find that sometimes he couldn't get home so, for him, winter tyres made his life a heck of a lot better.


I never had an issue in my RRs in any conditions / any terrain - I used Pirelli Scorpions which were M&S, but not winter compound... I drove in scottish hills / mountains in conditions which would normally preclude cars... but had no issues... I would be sure that it would have had no issues in the cotswold hills...

the point being is that Winter tyre compounds are but one tool available to the driver - type of car / attitude to driving / driving skills / etc. all play a part in successfully getting from A to B - and while I would support winter tyres as being a great solution (for the 3 days a year you need them!) to see them as a solution without considering the other changes / skills you need is I think fool-hardy - it can give drivers a sense of mis-placed confidence and superiority...

Alasdair

User avatar
jont-
Posts: 1000
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2015 7:12 am
Location: Flatlands

Re: Winter to summer tires

Postby jont- » Fri Apr 01, 2016 12:19 pm

akirk wrote:I never had an issue in my RRs in any conditions / any terrain - I used Pirelli Scorpions which were M&S, but not winter compound...

I thought M+S meant Mud and Snow?

Astraist
Posts: 239
Joined: Thu Oct 08, 2015 10:41 pm

Re: Winter to summer tires

Postby Astraist » Fri Apr 01, 2016 2:47 pm

Yes, but they aren't dedicated snow tyres.

In general, my thinking of the whole subject is that even the best driver needs a compliant car. Why should a given car be made any less compliant than it could be?

Gareth
Posts: 571
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2015 2:44 pm
Location: Berkshire
Contact:

Re: Winter to summer tires

Postby Gareth » Fri Apr 01, 2016 4:42 pm

akirk wrote:
Gareth wrote:One of my friends in a hilly part of the Cotswolds - a long-term advanced driver - used to find that sometimes he couldn't get home so, for him, winter tyres made his life a heck of a lot better.

I never had an issue in my RRs in any conditions / any terrain

Good point - he could have saved money by buying a RR instead :P
there is only the road, nothing but the road ...

User avatar
akirk
Posts: 1480
Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2015 6:58 pm
Location: Cotswolds

Re: Winter to summer tires

Postby akirk » Fri Apr 01, 2016 5:14 pm

jont- wrote:
akirk wrote:I never had an issue in my RRs in any conditions / any terrain - I used Pirelli Scorpions which were M&S, but not winter compound...

I thought M+S meant Mud and Snow?


As Astraist comments - that is not a compound designation - it relates to the tread pattern in terms of shifting mud / snow out of the tread...
M&S have I think a mountain graphic on the tyre, winter tyres have a snowflake - some have both!


Gareth wrote:
akirk wrote:
Gareth wrote:One of my friends in a hilly part of the Cotswolds - a long-term advanced driver - used to find that sometimes he couldn't get home so, for him, winter tyres made his life a heck of a lot better.

I never had an issue in my RRs in any conditions / any terrain

Good point - he could have saved money by buying a RR instead :P

I am glad you see my logic :) and the amount I tended to spend on RRs was probably less than winter tyres :D
of course the main point being that winter tyres are one part of an equation, the car / drive technology / driver skills are also parts of that equation - and in some scenarios you can choose which bit needs enhancement to meet your desired outcome - there is a degree of almost hysteria from some quarters about winter tyres - they save the world, you are instantly a driving god once you put them on - and that worries me as the public buy into that - I have seen ridiculous claims for winter tyres (similar to 4x4 drivers who believe that their expensive lump of metal will corner on ice as well as a sports car on tarmac!) - that can mean drivers doing things they shouldn't in the belief that their winter tyres will keep everything under control, as with so many things a more balanced view is needed and while they can be useful they are not necessary for the majority of British drivers, and will help some...

Alasdair

Gareth
Posts: 571
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2015 2:44 pm
Location: Berkshire
Contact:

Re: Winter to summer tires

Postby Gareth » Fri Apr 01, 2016 6:27 pm

akirk wrote:I have seen ridiculous claims for winter tyres - that can mean drivers doing things they shouldn't in the belief that their winter tyres will keep everything under control

I agree - when I first had winter tyres fitted my friends and I found they changed 'the conditions' such that drivers have a 20-30 mph advantage on fresh and compacted snow. The winter tyres I was using (and still use, fwiw) generally came out near the top in independent testing but, of course, technology has move on a bit since then. It's not unreasonable to expect people in different circumstances might make a different assessment, for example if they used less good tyres.
there is only the road, nothing but the road ...

waremark
Posts: 570
Joined: Fri Oct 02, 2015 9:23 am

Re: Winter to summer tires

Postby waremark » Sat Apr 02, 2016 10:11 pm

A RR on M&S tyres would get me home in snowy conditions. When I was a child my father (a regular on the Monte Carlo and Alpine rallies) generally managed ok with M&S tyres and lead in the boot. Only in extreme conditions did he borrow a Land Rover to take me to school (1963?).

But since I prefer to drive a car which comes on sporty modern tyres, changing them for winters at a cost of £20 twice a year is my solution.

Despite quite a few winter visits to Sweden and other visits to low grip facilities, I don't have the skills to make a car on sports tyres move up a snowy slope. With a 4 wheel drive car on sports tyres I reckoned that the safe speed dictated by long stopping distances was about 20 mph. It would have been 2 or 3 times as high on snow tyres.

I don't put winters on all our cars. When it snows I go out for pleasure in those which are suitably shod.

I don't know why I rise to these comments again and again. Our positions are entrenched and we know where we all stand.

Gareth
Posts: 571
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2015 2:44 pm
Location: Berkshire
Contact:

Re: Winter to summer tires

Postby Gareth » Sun Apr 10, 2016 8:53 pm

I reckon it's time to change tyres when there's little chance of cold inclement weather ...

This morning I went out for a little drive. Mid-morning, I was quite surprised when I noticed the car behind had some snow at the bottom of the windscreen. Then I spotted a few more, stopped counting once I saw more than a handful, and one even had snow mostly covering the windscreen - the driver had only cleared a small patch in front of his face.

P1050625.JPG
flower
P1050625.JPG (206.34 KiB) Viewed 2328 times

P1050626.JPG
cool
P1050626.JPG (164.49 KiB) Viewed 2328 times
there is only the road, nothing but the road ...

User avatar
jont-
Posts: 1000
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2015 7:12 am
Location: Flatlands

Re: Winter to summer tires

Postby jont- » Fri Apr 15, 2016 6:15 am

I changed the Clio back onto summer tyres just over a week ago. The morning commute is still around 5-6C and in the wet there's noticeably less grip available compared to when I had the winters on (typically manifested as scrabbling when pulling out of junctions, rather than just gripping and going). It's happened a couple of times, so I don't think it's "diesel".

Silk
Posts: 385
Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2015 9:24 pm
Location: South Glos.

Re: Winter to summer tires

Postby Silk » Fri Apr 15, 2016 7:43 pm

jont- wrote:I changed the Clio back onto summer tyres just over a week ago. The morning commute is still around 5-6C and in the wet there's noticeably less grip available compared to when I had the winters on (typically manifested as scrabbling when pulling out of junctions, rather than just gripping and going). It's happened a couple of times, so I don't think it's "diesel".


A Clio? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


Return to “Technology”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest