M1 Minibus "Accident"

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waremark
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Re: M1 Minibus "Accident"

Postby waremark » Sat Mar 24, 2018 11:29 pm

Strangely Brown wrote:A conversation with a disembodied voice requires a great deal more cognitive processing and use of the visual cortex than the same conversation face-to-face. Those that insist they are quite safe on a hands-free call seem to unable or unwilling to accept that.

In car conversation would be far more distracting than hands free phone conversation if it actually was face to face! Of course it is distracting but probably less so than talking to a back seat passenger.

Light chatter does not use the same sort of brainpower as the tests of mental agility that others are mentioning. And I don't think your ability to remember where you have been has much relevance to how safely you were driving.

Feel free to come for a drive, and assess my driving while I am chatting to a family member!

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Re: M1 Minibus "Accident"

Postby Strangely Brown » Sun Mar 25, 2018 7:46 am

I think we should go for a drive regardless of the phone question. :gear:

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Re: M1 Minibus "Accident"

Postby waremark » Sun Mar 25, 2018 7:34 pm

Strangely Brown wrote:I think we should go for a drive regardless of the phone question. :gear:

Pl :gear:

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Re: M1 Minibus "Accident"

Postby Pontoneer » Mon Apr 02, 2018 9:49 pm

martine wrote:...
[*]passengers tend to naturally pause the conversation if the driver is faced with a tricky situation[/list]


Not in the case of my nearest & dearest , or her ( non driving ) mother - both of whom will raise voices or shout my name if I don’t participate in their conversation , when the task of driving demands my full concentration. And I have tried to politely explain this to both of them at different times .

I try to avoid mobile telephony because I know it transports my attention to some remote imaginary location : visualising the person on the other end of the call , rather than watching what is happening around me - hence I very very rarely do it , and then only briefly and at times/places of my choosing where I consider the risks low .

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Re: M1 Minibus "Accident"

Postby Pontoneer » Mon Apr 02, 2018 10:43 pm

TheInsanity1234 wrote:
Strangely Brown wrote:
TheInsanity1234 wrote:Plus, sorry, but I may be a stupid 20 year old but i'd appreciate some damn respect thank you.


Why do you presume that you are entitled to respect when you admit openly that you are a hypocrite who texts and drives? Respect is earned, not given.

Here's a great big juicy tip for you. It's free, gratis and for nothing and I guarantee absolutely that it will stop you feeling that tell-tale bzz,bzz,bzz that tempts you to reach into your pocket to check the phone.

TURN THE BLOODY THING OFF!!!

Is that really so difficult? If you are incapable of controlling the urge then remove the temptation. Easy.

Here endeth the lesson.

[Edit: That split infinitive was really bugging me. :)]

(Insert eye roll) - Please read my posts, sir. I already said I put the phone on do not disturb almost as a part of my routine, it's just on the occasions I forget to do it.

Also, the irony here is if I told you to fuck off, you'd moan about how us youngsters don't respect you older people. If you're not going to give me some kind of minimum level of respect, I'm most certainly not going to give any back.

akirk wrote:
TheInsanity1234 wrote:I may be a stupid 20 year old


that you are not :D - well you might be 20 ;) but you know what I mean
however, as above - respect is heard-earned - and esp. in the AD community - I think there has been a lot of respect on here over the years for your attitude and approach, but can understand why there would be a frustration for others with this - it isn't difficult - my phone lives on silent anyway (I prefer to be in control of when I use it, not having it control me...) so in the car, it is placed down in a convenient space - face down, I then pick it up again at the end of the journey - easy, and no temptation...

so, I hear what you are saying about trying to do something about it - but it is a choice - part of your routine for getting in a car can simply be to turn it off / put it on silent and then out of reach - temptation gone...

Alasdair

Is nobody reading what I say? I try to integrate it into my routine, but occasionally slip up and it doesn't happen. :headbang:

Gareth wrote:
TheInsanity1234 wrote:As to the "your generation" comment, I think it's rather rude of you to generalise like that.

He extrapolated from the idea that the actions you admitted are typical of your age range. I'm not sure why you should be upset for being taken to task for behaviour that you admitted, and I'm not sure why you should be especially upset at the slur on others of approximately the same age that they behave as you.

I'm not particularly upset at being taken to task, but I am upset at how older people seem to constantly blame younger people for all that is wrong with the world, when the older generations aren't perfect themselves.

ANYWAY, to shut you all the fuck up, I will continue with trying to make it a habit to always put my phone on Do Not Disturb and pop it in the glovebox, and never ever admit to being anything less than a perfect driving god, to avoid you all putting me through the wringer for being capable of putting my hands up and saying "I am not perfect, because I do things like this, but I am trying to improve myself"

:cheers:

(I do respect the amount of experience behind these opinions on this forum, and debates like these where you all pick on me always do provide me with amusement after the case, I just get hot headed in the midst of it all :P)


Hey , please don’t think that we’re ALL giving you grief . I , for one , appreciate your honesty , and in return will admit that I sometimes do the same .

However , the offence , is using a handheld mobile device , and since mine is in a cradle , where it resides due to my main mobile use being for navigation , it isn’t handheld .

Oh , and if stopped at lights , or in a traffic jam , turn off your engine and you’re no longer ‘driving’ , therefore no offence in using a handheld device , but it is still best avoided . Still shows , though , that many don’t know the law .

On rare occasions that I might make a call whilst driving , usually to let others know if I’ve been delayed , then that call will be initiated by voice dialling . My Bury car kits will voice dial with any phone , and Siri on my iPhone will do it directly with a press of the home button , or via my Apple watch , which simply needs lifted to activate voice command ; I don’t ever use the last two methods , but they exist .

If I receive a text message or email , I can ask Siri to read it to me , and if I wish to respond I can dictate a reply , all at a time of my choosing . Text to speech or vice versa are quite commonplace now , so no excuse for reading from screens or typing whilst driving .

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Re: M1 Minibus "Accident"

Postby Pontoneer » Mon Apr 02, 2018 10:53 pm

fungus wrote:
TheInsanity1234 wrote:
Strangely Brown wrote:
TheInsanity1234 wrote:You're giving me a headache.

I won't turn my phone off, it takes 40 years to turn back on.

But beginning from now, I will ensure my phone is always hidden away so I can't get to it.

Happy?


I don't know. Words are cheap so it depends what "hidden away" actually means in practice. It sounds to me like you need to make sure that you place it somewhere that is inaccessible from the driver's seat. e.g. the boot. How well you succeed in breaking your "habit" depends entirely on how much you *want* to succeed. If you don't make it, then you didn't really want to do it in the first place. Like I said, words are cheap.

FTAOD, I genuinely hope that you do make it. If not, then I hope you get caught before you do any serious damage. Ultimately, it's down to you.

Glovebox? In my bag, somewhere on the rear seat? Or will you not be satisfied until I've purchased a nuclear bunker to pop into the boot and lock my phone away under there with at least 4 different locking mechanisms? (tongue firmly in cheek)

I must admit to wondering why one can't purchase cars with 'phone holders' where you can put your phone into it, and when you turn on the ignition, it then closes and locks until you've stopped and turned the ignition off. I'd find that great, as if I'm in a rush I just throw my phone into the driver's door pocket, or on the passenger seat, so it's kind of easily accessible, but if I could have a hole in the cabin which I could conveniently put my phone into when getting into the car, that'd be great

Really my problem arises when I'm in a rush. If I'm taking it easy and I've got time to put the phone away somewhere, then no problems arise on the journey. But if I'm running late and I just want to get the dog in the car and then fuck off to the next place 10 minutes late, then I just throw the phone somewhere and then oops, here I go picking it up to text someone I'm late when I'm stopped at the next set of traffic lights.

Mr Cholmondeley-Warner wrote:You could turn it off anyway, and be safe from texting accidents for the next 40 years :D

Well done for sticking with the debate. I suspect you'll find it easier than you think to break the habit, now that you've made the commitment. Good luck.

Nah, in 40 years everyone will probably have a mobile phone surgically implanted into their head meaning they can text and make phone calls everywhere they go :mrgreen:

I could, but equally I dislike the length of time taken for my phone to start up these days, so just try to stick it on do not disturb. If I have bluetooth activated, it automatically blocks all notifications and blocks you from operating the phone while it's connected to the car's bluetooth. Pretty neat feature, and one I use very often (but again this relies on me remembering to actually turn the bluetooth on).

It's very annoying to have people scolding at me and saying things that appear to be very...inflammatory, especially when I have said such things to myself. Kind of makes it seem like the other party thinks I'm stupider than I actually am, which is understandably annoying, but hey, at the end of the day, I am an idiot and I just have to step back and look at what they're saying while removing the personal aspects of what they're saying.

Straying from the topic again, but is linked, I have often wondered what is the legality of those smart watches. A lot can do the same functions as a mobile phone, and plenty of them even allow you to send texts from the watch, or browse you-twit-face, or make phone calls. But technically, they're not a handheld device, they're on the wrist. If they're legal, what's stopping me from strapping my phone to my wrist and claiming it's just a smart watch with a 5.5 inch screen :roll:


The law states that you must be in control of your vehicle at all times, so if you think that you're James Bond and talk on your smart watch, then you could be deemed to be not in control of your vehicle. So technically you are commiting an offence.

Nigel.


Even a hands free conversation can fall foul of that , which kind of takes us back to the start of this thread .

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Re: M1 Minibus "Accident"

Postby Pontoneer » Mon Apr 02, 2018 11:02 pm

Strangely Brown wrote:
TheInsanity1234 wrote:
Strangely Brown wrote:I don't understand why you "have to remember" to switch bluetooth on. If it has the capability of preventing you using the phone while connected then why on earth do you switch it off?

Because when I am without the car for long periods of time, it's a waste of battery having the bluetooth switched on. My car's bluetooth is the only thing I have connected to the phone. Bear in mind, my sister tends to have the car most of the time, so these days my driving is more on a casual weekend basis when I need the car.


Seriously? The amount of battery used by an inactive bluetooth facility is so insignificant when compared to powering the screen and 3G/4G data use that you are chasing false economies. Add in the *massive* benefit that as soon as you get in the car and it connects to the head-unit you'll be prevented from messing with texts [your description] then surely it is a no brainer. Turn it on and leave it on.

Agreed , I leave it on all the time , and the phone just connects to the carkit in each of our cars as soon as I get in .

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Re: M1 Minibus "Accident"

Postby Pontoneer » Mon Apr 02, 2018 11:17 pm

TheInsanity1234 wrote:I am a heavy user though, so batteries never provide me with a long charge. I think the battery on this phone is significantly smaller than my previous one too.

3,200 mAh for the Note 3 vs 2,900 mAh. Plus my usage will have changed over the course of a year, but my iPhone definitely seems a tad more inefficient than my previous phone. Probably mainly due to a LCD vs a LED screen on my last phone. It's a pain, but that's what I paid my money for!


I’ve had every iPhone since the original , currently on a 7 , as I always wait until a new model comes out then get the outgoing model as a ‘free’ upgrade . I always have BT , WiFi and GPS on and seldom ever got less than a day out of a charge .

Since I’ve always had Bury System 8 / CC9060 kits with charging cradles in my cars , the phones generally get an hours charging during my morning and evening commutes and that was always enough , besides being in the cradle during other journeys.

If away from the car for extended periods, I also have an external battery, or can plug into my computers to charge as well as sync .

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Re: M1 Minibus "Accident"

Postby Pontoneer » Mon Apr 02, 2018 11:32 pm

Gareth wrote:
Horse wrote:I didn't know that it happened in darkness

I'd spotted that from the video in the article linked in the second post of the thread ;-) ... and commented then about how that might have made a difference.

Regarding conspicuity of emergency vehicles on the hard shoulder of a motorway at night, I've been caught out a couple of times where there's been multiple with flashing lights, which makes it extremely difficult (almost impossible) to see if the adjacent lane is clear.

The worst instance was on the M40 a few years ago when the matrix signs warned that lane one was closed ahead and that an advisory 40 mph limit was in place. Since it was more than scary keeping to 40 mph in lane one I decided it would be too dangerous to do so in lane two. On approach to the line of flashing vehicles on the hard shoulder, my night vision was so fucked up by the bright flashing lights I had trouble spotting a gap in lane two.

I had a similar experience a few nights ago , approaching roadworks in darkness , the intense amber lights on some of the vehicles were so bright I just couldn’t determine whether they were on the hard shoulder , which they turned out to be , nor could I see beyond them - had to slow right down and pass with caution.

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Re: M1 Minibus "Accident"

Postby Pontoneer » Mon Apr 02, 2018 11:40 pm

TheInsanity1234 wrote:
Strangely Brown wrote:
Gareth wrote:Do police officers ever use mobile phones while they are driving?


Argumentum ad verecundiam, and a weak one at that. In particular, congitive bias.

To answer the question: they probably do. And it would make them wrong too.

I often wonder why it's deemed unacceptable for people to drive using a mobile phone, but perfectly fine for officers to drive around while using the radios clipped to their vests, which often require a button to be pushed in...

The law distinguishes between a two way telephone conversation with both channels active and a two way radio conversation with PTT for one direction at a time active ( and much of the time neither side transmitting ) the suggestion being that such conversations are more brief and less distracting .


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