RoSPA launches website to keep older drivers safe on the roads

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superplum
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Re: RoSPA launches website to keep older drivers safe on the roads

Postby superplum » Mon Mar 21, 2016 8:04 pm

dave51 wrote:Going away from the thread a little, but I found on switching to a more powerful automatic version of the same model it was much more difficult to maintain a set speed without reference to the instruments, and in urban situations I prefer to keep all my attention on the road and its surroundings.
I have been looking for some device that would monitor speed against limit to give a back up warning but so far have not found one, except as part of a camera warning device, which I do not want. Perhaps I could get one but delete the cameras?


If you have a smartphone (or one that's slightly smart!) download a free HUD application that will reflect back to you via the windscreen. It will most likely be more accurate (GPS-based) than your speedo.
8-)

TheInsanity1234
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Re: RoSPA launches website to keep older drivers safe on the roads

Postby TheInsanity1234 » Mon Mar 21, 2016 8:10 pm

fungus wrote:although for a deaf person the speedometer and rev counter are a must.

Obviously, individuals are different, and while I shall agree with the necessity of a rev counter if you're obsessed with rev-matching, they're not really a 'must'...

Speedometers, again, aren't a must either. If I'm in the appropriate gear for a certain speed, I have no trouble sticking to it, I only have issues when following the silly gear-shift thing (a rare occasion) and going to 4th in 30. But, even then, I find in those cases, I use cruise control to keep my speed constant.

I think another issue with modern cars is the electronically controlled throttle, which seems to have a odd distribution of 'power' across the pedal travel. In our Yeti, the first 30% or so of the pedal travel seems to control between 50% and 60% of the total power output, meaning if you're on a light throttle in a high gear, and you push down the pedal by an imperceptible amount, you'll find yourself adding 5 mph to your speed without noticing.

fungus
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Re: RoSPA launches website to keep older drivers safe on the roads

Postby fungus » Mon Mar 21, 2016 9:58 pm

TheInsanity1234 wrote:
fungus wrote:although for a deaf person the speedometer and rev counter are a must.

Obviously, individuals are different, and while I shall agree with the necessity of a rev counter if you're obsessed with rev-matching, they're not really a 'must'...

Speedometers, again, aren't a must either. If I'm in the appropriate gear for a certain speed, I have no trouble sticking to it, I only have issues when following the silly gear-shift thing (a rare occasion) and going to 4th in 30. But, even then, I find in those cases, I use cruise control to keep my speed constant.

I think another issue with modern cars is the electronically controlled throttle, which seems to have a odd distribution of 'power' across the pedal travel. In our Yeti, the first 30% or so of the pedal travel seems to control between 50% and 60% of the total power output, meaning if you're on a light throttle in a high gear, and you push down the pedal by an imperceptible amount, you'll find yourself adding 5 mph to your speed without noticing.


But if you drove a smaller car with stiffer suspension you would feel as if you were travelling faster, especially if the car were closer to the ground. Similarly, if you drove a larger more comfortable car you would feel as if you were travelling slower than the car you're used to, just as when you leave the motorway after driving for an hour at motorway speeds and then enter a 30mph limit, you feel as if you're travelling at 15mph, therefor the need to reference the speedo.

Nigel.

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jont-
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Re: RoSPA launches website to keep older drivers safe on the roads

Postby jont- » Tue Mar 22, 2016 8:08 am

TheInsanity1234 wrote:I think another issue with modern cars is the electronically controlled throttle, which seems to have a odd distribution of 'power' across the pedal travel. In our Yeti, the first 30% or so of the pedal travel seems to control between 50% and 60% of the total power output, meaning if you're on a light throttle in a high gear, and you push down the pedal by an imperceptible amount, you'll find yourself adding 5 mph to your speed without noticing.

Our Skoda is much the same. When you first drive it, you think "oooh, this is quite poky", then find the rest of the throttle pedal travel makes little difference :roll: Similarly with massively over-servoed brakes - the average driver thinks "ooh, these are good", not "ooh, these are horrible to modulate" :lol:

TheInsanity1234
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Re: RoSPA launches website to keep older drivers safe on the roads

Postby TheInsanity1234 » Tue Mar 22, 2016 7:31 pm

fungus wrote:But if you drove a smaller car with stiffer suspension you would feel as if you were travelling faster, especially if the car were closer to the ground. Similarly, if you drove a larger more comfortable car you would feel as if you were travelling slower than the car you're used to, just as when you leave the motorway after driving for an hour at motorway speeds and then enter a 30mph limit, you feel as if you're travelling at 15mph, therefor the need to reference the speedo.

Nigel.

In that case, the same must be true for hearing people, mustn't it?

So a speedometer is a necessity for every single driver, regardless of hearing levels...

jont- wrote:
TheInsanity1234 wrote:I think another issue with modern cars is the electronically controlled throttle, which seems to have a odd distribution of 'power' across the pedal travel. In our Yeti, the first 30% or so of the pedal travel seems to control between 50% and 60% of the total power output, meaning if you're on a light throttle in a high gear, and you push down the pedal by an imperceptible amount, you'll find yourself adding 5 mph to your speed without noticing.

Our Skoda is much the same. When you first drive it, you think "oooh, this is quite poky", then find the rest of the throttle pedal travel makes little difference :roll: Similarly with massively over-servoed brakes - the average driver thinks "ooh, these are good", not "ooh, these are horrible to modulate" :lol:

I only discovered the issue with it when attempting to join the A34 at one of its famed short slip roads, I was in 2nd, prodded the throttle and the car gave a nice shove, then I changed to 3rd and carried on accelerating (I was doing about 45ish at this point, just entered the left lane), realised a car was gaining pretty quickly, so I put my foot to the floor and the car seemed to accelerate no faster than it already had been.

I also dislike the brakes, they're very snatch-y, and while fine for heavy braking from high speeds, they're not nice to use at low speeds where light braking is the order of the task.

fungus
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Re: RoSPA launches website to keep older drivers safe on the roads

Postby fungus » Tue Mar 22, 2016 7:50 pm

TheInsanity1234 wrote:
fungus wrote:But if you drove a smaller car with stiffer suspension you would feel as if you were travelling faster, especially if the car were closer to the ground. Similarly, if you drove a larger more comfortable car you would feel as if you were travelling slower than the car you're used to, just as when you leave the motorway after driving for an hour at motorway speeds and then enter a 30mph limit, you feel as if you're travelling at 15mph, therefor the need to reference the speedo.

Nigel.

In that case, the same must be true for hearing people, mustn't it?

So a speedometer is a necessity for every single driver, regardless of hearing levels...

jont- wrote:
TheInsanity1234 wrote:I think another issue with modern cars is the electronically controlled throttle, which seems to have a odd distribution of 'power' across the pedal travel. In our Yeti, the first 30% or so of the pedal travel seems to control between 50% and 60% of the total power output, meaning if you're on a light throttle in a high gear, and you push down the pedal by an imperceptible amount, you'll find yourself adding 5 mph to your speed without noticing.

Our Skoda is much the same. When you first drive it, you think "oooh, this is quite poky", then find the rest of the throttle pedal travel makes little difference :roll: Similarly with massively over-servoed brakes - the average driver thinks "ooh, these are good", not "ooh, these are horrible to modulate" :lol:

I only discovered the issue with it when attempting to join the A34 at one of its famed short slip roads, I was in 2nd, prodded the throttle and the car gave a nice shove, then I changed to 3rd and carried on accelerating (I was doing about 45ish at this point, just entered the left lane), realised a car was gaining pretty quickly, so I put my foot to the floor and the car seemed to accelerate no faster than it already had been.

I also dislike the brakes, they're very snatch-y, and while fine for heavy braking from high speeds, they're not nice to use at low speeds where light braking is the order of the task.


You are correct about drivers with hearing needing a speedometer when driving different cars. It is also a fact that most drivers haven't a clue within plus or minus 5mph of the speed limit whether they are within the speed limit. I am now talking about driving within about 1mph of the limit.

The brakes on my old 1.9tdi Ibiza were identical to my wifes Octavia tdi, in that they required the lightest of touches at low speed, but you could realy hammer the brakes and it took a lot to set off the ABS, even at low speed.

Nigel.

TheInsanity1234
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Re: RoSPA launches website to keep older drivers safe on the roads

Postby TheInsanity1234 » Tue Mar 22, 2016 8:18 pm

fungus wrote:You are correct about drivers with hearing needing a speedometer when driving different cars. It is also a fact that most drivers haven't a clue within plus or minus 5mph of the speed limit whether they are within the speed limit. I am now talking about driving within about 1mph of the limit.

Well, an ordinary speedometer wouldn't be able to tell you if you're driving within about 1 mph of the speed limit, you'd have to have a digital speedometer which has been calibrated very accurately.
Even your hearing won't be able to detect the difference between 31 and 30 mph anyway.

I'm not sure why you said that speedometers are a necessity for deaf people, but not for hearing people. They're a necessity for everybody, aren't they?

fungus wrote:The brakes on my old 1.9tdi Ibiza were identical to my wifes Octavia tdi, in that they required the lightest of touches at low speed, but you could realy hammer the brakes and it took a lot to set off the ABS, even at low speed.

Nigel.

The ABS in the Yeti seems to be pretty sensitive. Either that, or I brake with far more force than is necessary when doing emergency stops.

I seem to activate the ABS nearly every time I have to perform an emergency stop, regardless of road surface, weather, ambient temperature, tyre tread levels etc etc.

WhoseGeneration
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Re: RoSPA launches website to keep older drivers safe on the roads

Postby WhoseGeneration » Tue Mar 22, 2016 8:30 pm

TheInsanity1234 wrote:The ABS in the Yeti seems to be pretty sensitive. Either that, or I brake with far more force than is necessary when doing emergency stops.

I seem to activate the ABS nearly every time I have to perform an emergency stop, regardless of road surface, weather, ambient temperature, tyre tread levels etc etc.


Well, you've opened yourself up to a bit of questioning about your driving if you're regularly performing emergency stops.

TripleS
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Re: RoSPA launches website to keep older drivers safe on the roads

Postby TripleS » Wed Mar 23, 2016 7:20 am

WhoseGeneration wrote:
TheInsanity1234 wrote:The ABS in the Yeti seems to be pretty sensitive. Either that, or I brake with far more force than is necessary when doing emergency stops.

I seem to activate the ABS nearly every time I have to perform an emergency stop, regardless of road surface, weather, ambient temperature, tyre tread levels etc etc.


Well, you've opened yourself up to a bit of questioning about your driving if you're regularly performing emergency stops.


Quite: I thought the same. Are we doing a bit too much running before we've learned to walk properly?

Sorry and all that, and a lot of credit is due to our young friend, but there is, inevitably, much experience still to be acquired. Try to acquire it safely and don't try to do too much too soon.

Best wishes all,
Dave.

dave51
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Re: RoSPA launches website to keep older drivers safe on the roads

Postby dave51 » Wed Mar 23, 2016 11:43 am

waremark wrote:
dave51 wrote:Going away from the thread a little, but I found on switching to a more powerful automatic version of the same model it was much more difficult to maintain a set speed without reference to the instruments, and in urban situations I prefer to keep all my attention on the road and its surroundings.

Is it so dreadful to include the speedo in an occasional scan?

Do you take advantage of a cruise control?

I have and have had cars with speed limiters but don't choose to use them. These devices do not allow you to exceed the set speed unless you apply a second pressure to the accelerator pedal. It sounds as though this is a feature you should look for on your next car.


I do look at the instrument panel, in part to check for warning lights, but I try to look at the road and surroundings occasionally (irony alert). It's all about getting the right balance.
But I am concerned when I hear about zero speed tolerance being introduced, that people may be encouraged to shift attention to the clock at the expense of safety. While a pedestrian's chances of survival at 30 are better than at 35, it's better by far not to hit them at all.
For the record I often drop down to 20 or so in busy areas, if appropriate, and am able to keep to a set speed when required. I use cruise control when appropriate, but this is not always the case, particularly in urban traffic.
A speed limiter would be a possible answer if it were available on my car; it's not important enough to me to change it. Using such a device will itself involve some distraction if it continually needed to be reset on change of limit.


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