Advanced Driving Hub

Thanks for the link, but as this is an advanced driving forum, and we all come across cyclists, pedestrians, horse riders and many other things whilst driving. Not to mention that some of us also cycle. Why shouldn't there be sensible discussions about those things we encounter, so as to further our understanding of other road users and their behaviour? Cycling forums tend to be just as one sided as car forums

SD's earlier comments seem to show an attitude common to many motorists. Not very advanced at all.

Imsensible wrote:SD's earlier comments seem to show an attitude common to many motorists. Not very advanced at all.

To make sure you've not been infected by Silk, what in particular do you object to?

Have you considered that many motorists won't remember seeing or passing a well or courteously ridden bicycle, because nothing will have irritated them? On the other hand if you come across a cyclist that is determined to be obnoxious, well, then, they will probably be remembered.

I came upon a cyclist on Saturday, on a narrow country lane with enough room for a car to pass in each direction with care. As I let the speed drop on approach, I ddc'd 4th to 3rd, 3rd to 2nd, and finally 2nd to 1st, the cyclist finally noticed I was waiting a little way behind and found some smooth road to the left that allowed me to pass, and held his hand up, probably to thank me for not being aggressive in response to his prior positioning near the crown of the road. The road surface had been mostly poor, with a few good patches; I understood the reason for his positioning, although it seemed that initially he hadn't been aware there was another road user in the vicinity, since he could have moved over a bit earlier than he did.

Some years ago there was a similar situation, a cyclist near the crown of a narrow country lane. That time, the surface was mostly good, and it appeared there was no good reason for the positioning, which continued for a considerable distance, and was only resolved when the road widened a bit and the cyclist had, probably by mistake, moved a little bit to the left. I could have passed pretty much at any time, but I'm loathe to pass a cyclist without there being a safety margin gap, even if the speed is low.

Guess which cyclist I'll remember next year?

I still remember the three cyclists in Wareham about eight years ago who insisted upon riding three abreast when they could easily have ridden single file allowing cars to pass safely, but no, they road like this for about half a mile after leaving the town before one pulled back allowing cars to pass safely. This IMHO is just bloody mindedness, and is exactly the type of behaviour that annoys motorists.

Nigel.

fungus wrote:I still remember the three cyclists in Wareham about eight years ago who insisted upon riding three abreast when they could easily have ridden single file allowing cars to pass safely, but no, they road like this for about half a mile after leaving the town before one pulled back allowing cars to pass safely. This IMHO is just bloody mindedness, and is exactly the type of behaviour that annoys motorists.

Nigel.

I kind of prefer cyclists riding in blocks over riding in single file, mainly because I always go fully on to the right in order to pass them, regardless of where they are in the left lane. This means when they're in a block, I only have to worry about overtaking something that's about a metre long at the most, but when they're riding in single file, the distance I've got to be on the other side of the road for is much longer, meaning opportunities for overtaking are much less common.

However, the best case would be one where the cyclists are riding in single file with about 4 car lengths between each of them. That means I can overtake one at a time much more safely than overtaking 3 in a line, or 3 in a block.

TheInsanity1234 wrote:

fungus wrote:I still remember the three cyclists in Wareham about eight years ago who insisted upon riding three abreast when they could easily have ridden single file allowing cars to pass safely, but no, they road like this for about half a mile after leaving the town before one pulled back allowing cars to pass safely. This IMHO is just bloody mindedness, and is exactly the type of behaviour that annoys motorists.

Nigel.

I kind of prefer cyclists riding in blocks over riding in single file, mainly because I always go fully on to the right in order to pass them, regardless of where they are in the left lane. This means when they're in a block, I only have to worry about overtaking something that's about a metre long at the most, but when they're riding in single file, the distance I've got to be on the other side of the road for is much longer, meaning opportunities for overtaking are much less common.

However, the best case would be one where the cyclists are riding in single file with about 4 car lengths between each of them. That means I can overtake one at a time much more safely than overtaking 3 in a line, or 3 in a block.

I agree, but one of the three was taking up some of the right hand side of the road leaving no room to pass even though it woud have been safe to go completely offside. There were obviously no approaching vehicles.

Nigel.

I think you need to buy a new tape measure - your current one's obviously got rather stretched ...

Gareth wrote:

Imsensible wrote:SD's earlier comments seem to show an attitude common to many motorists. Not very advanced at all.

To make sure you've not been infected by Silk, what in particular do you object to?

SD wrote:

"IME (and we get a lot of mass training runs and competition triathlons around here) there are plenty of cyclists who do not pay sufficient attention to the danger they present to themselves (and arguably to those who are going to impact them)."

Perhaps he would be wise to consider the danger that a ton or more of metal travelling at speed, driven by a thoughtless, selfish plonker poses to other legitimate road users, such as cyclists, rather than the danger cyclists pose to them.

Also, with regard to your story, ask yourself if ever the positions are reversed? Do cyclists remember 'good' motorists and 'bad' ones more?

The attitude seems to be that cyclists are somehow second class citizens.

Only in your belief in what my attitude is...

My comment was simply that my experience is that, in the sort of competitive situation that is common around here, a cyclist will think nothing of swinging out into the path of a mechanically propelled vehicle - either one approaching from front or behind - simply because they want to overtake the competitor in front. No consideration is given to safety; no lifesaver checks, nothing. I have no issue whatsoever with cyclists on the road and certainly don't consider them second class citizens.

But there is a tipping point - rules 66 to 68 ought to be observed (note ought, not must or even should). It's managing the expectation of others.

The second part of my comment also comes from previous experience - I've seen people truly devastated after an incident in which they are wholly innocent but in which someone has suffered 'life-threatening' or 'life-changing' injuries to a more vulnerable road user.

Feel free to think i'm bigoted... and feel free to lump me in with the rest of the cycle-hating arrogant drivers if you like. We're all entitled to our own opinion.

Imsensible wrote:The attitude seems to be that cyclists are somehow second class citizens.

Whose attitude? Are you sure you're not projecting?

We are just entering silly season around here with lots of 'cycle events' on a couple of local roads...
not quite sure who they think they are fooling in calling it a cycle event - race numbers on their backs / wobbly bikes with central handlebars / streamlined helmets / etc. and the way in which they cycle - they are clearly racing... one such cyclist was 'knocked' into the verge a couple of years ago by a passing car - why, because at the point that the car passed them slowly and carefully the following cyclist decided to overtake the pack in front and cycled straight into the car wing, bounced off and across to the verge - but apparently he was 'knocked into the verge' - not his fault at all - luckily not injured, but a written off bike I suspect having passed by 5 minutes later... The weird thing is that most cyclists are motorists, and many motorists are cyclists - me included, I have a very nice carbon-fibre racing mountain bike... yet once on a bike - and especially once in Lycra or with a race number on the back they seem to change into eco-warriors who own the road and have rights over everything - rather like the thread on the motorcyclists, all humans need to balance rights and responsibilities - it is not cyclists that are disliked, it is the attitude so often portrayed by them

Alasdair